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Whale Inlet Socket – With Integrated Pressure

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Post by Johnuready Thu Apr 08, 2021 7:52 pm

I have a 2011 Broadway only used for  a few weeks and always had a slow fill with the external whale pump from a roller tank plugged into the wall inlet plate.

Was this a fitting that a previous owner installed as I can see no point in having it as my water tank has a pump.
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Post by Paramedic Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:07 pm

If I understand you correctly, the external Whale pump plugged into the sidewall is the only means of filling the under slung fresh water tank. The submersible pump in the tank gives outflow to taps and shower. Regards.

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Post by Johnuready Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:21 pm

Paramedic wrote:If I understand you correctly, the external Whale pump plugged into the sidewall is the only means of filling the under slung fresh water tank. The submersible pump in the tank gives outflow to taps and shower. Regards.
Thats correct. Last year on a site I used the adapter that fits the sidewall and connected the a filling hose directly.  This filled showing a full tank by the overflow spilling out on the ground, still not a quick fill. As we stayed at sites where we wanted to stay on a pitch with no water tap I then started to use a roller tank and the whale external filling pump that I found in the cupboard when we purchased the motorhome. This filled slowly and today as we test out for going out soon the filling was very slow. 

I am lost why I need the sidewall filler with the pressure sensor and solenoid valve? why not just a filler?

Any ideas
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Post by Paramedic Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:00 pm

Indeed, as you're probably aware, the more later van's have the added conventional fill with hose pipe or watering can. Yes the Whale filling method many will say is slow but we have got used to it as can do other setting up tasks in the meantime. I think the pressure sensor and solenoid valve comes more into its own if say, your pitch has a fresh water tap (permanently left open) whereby with the Whale long hose connected, you have continuous topping up of the fresh water tank as water is drawn from the taps.

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Post by Johnuready Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:10 am

New day and a fresh look at the slow fill.

Used a 12volt power supply and tested the whale pump in the roller ball, a very good head of pressure.

Took out the solenoid and found a very blocked filter.

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Post by bolero boy Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:33 am

several Uk brands use this method....its a great polariser...love it or hate it...
i guess that, as the move from caravans to MH picked up a few years ago, this sort of 'caravan' feature probably made many migrators feel more comfortable as this is what theyd been used to.
much advice for and against.

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Post by Johnuready Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:33 pm

Anybody taken the solinod valve out and replaced with pipe. Even with a clean filter the tank still fills slowly. 

Does the pipe go from the solinod directly to the tank? Is there anything inside the tank to restrict the flow?
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Post by bolero boy Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:40 pm

i suggested this to another poster who was struggling (the electrics were faulty, who needs electric to get water from a hose into a tank?) and was told that a normal round water inlet wouldnt fit into the square hole (heard that one before?) and that the new pipe were thick(er) and took up locker space....
id rip out the whale pipework to create some space, leave the square hole and blank it off, put in new hole and a pipe to tank...
just this one 'feature' would stop me buying any van thus 'equipped'.

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Post by Johnuready Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:21 pm

I have ordered the bits to remove the solenoid and try a direct connection.

Anybody know if there is any restriction on the pipe that leaves the output of the solenoid on its way to the tank or in the tank?
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Post by bolero boy Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:23 pm

John, hopefully an AS owner will help, i cant comment further but wish you luck with the change.
perhaps if you get a successful conclusion, you could report back as this might interest some other members.

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Post by Peter Brown Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:39 pm

The operation of the solenoid is controlled by a float valve in the fresh water tank so as the tank approaches being full, the flow will slow down then stop but if the tank is empty and the filter clear you get a reasonable flow for a small bore pipe.

The system is designed that way so you can leave the van permanently connected to a mains water tap and the van will auto-fill. Many users also like it because when they are filling the van with water they can just walk away and forget about it in the knowledge that when the tank is full the solenoid will close.
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Post by roger7webster Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:58 pm

Prior to removing the whale system I replaced the solenoid valve with a pipe . No problem if using the whale hose as this has a flow restrictor in the MH end connctor. Tank just overflows when full.
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Post by Johnuready Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:55 pm

roger7webster wrote:Prior to removing the whale system I replaced the solenoid valve with a pipe . No problem if using the whale hose as this has a flow restrictor in the MH end connctor. Tank just overflows when full.
Roger - my first few weeks last year of having a Motorhome I was filling up on site and over flowing when filling up. I asked Autosleeper why I didn’t have the shut off function ie float, they said it was not fitted to my 2011 Broadway. If that is true I don’t know. Assumed they were correct. Anybody else with a 2011 Broadway with auto shut off?
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Post by Peter Brown Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:55 am

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Post by merv Sat Apr 10, 2021 10:44 am

You can have a 'hole in the wall' filler system retro fitted. I had one fitted on a Nuevo.
The Whale system was left in place and could be used if required.
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Post by bolero boy Sat Apr 10, 2021 10:55 am

I guess one of the reasons for moving away from it would be that, to use it as in the second 'example' a key component is an Aquaroll (or similar).
these dont fold down very well and must take up a fair chunk of storage, especially when this is a precious resource.

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Post by marconi Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:03 am

I suppose they could mean lifting the heavy water container to pour it in, but isn't this a bit contradictory.

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Post by roger7webster Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:58 pm

I fitted a "hole in the wall"  filler as follows
1. Remove the whale socket
2. Move the EHU socket to the whale filler hole
3. Install a new water inlet & filling hose in the ehu socket hole.
This suited my particular van layout but probably not a universal solution.
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Post by Caraman Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:33 pm

I've removed the gauze filter and replaced the solenoid valve with a short piece of pipe to increase the flow.  I found that the pressure switch sometimes resulted in the solenoid and external whale pump pulsing on and off.  I do still have a float valve which cuts the 12v supply to the whale inlet socket and therefore the external whale pump when the fresh water tank is full.  However, the fresh water tank will overflow if I connect a hose to the inlet socket just as it does if I feed the hose into the gravity water filler but I don't regard this as a problem.  I've made a small plug which fits into the whale inlet socket to stop wee beasties getting into the fresh water tank when the whale inlet plug isn't connected.


Last edited by Caraman on Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:37 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : typo)
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Post by Molly3 Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:37 pm

At home I always  fill from the drain  tap much quicker  .
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Post by Johnuready Sun Apr 11, 2021 2:27 pm

Thanks for all your help. Today I went back to basics and tried filling from the mains pressure into the whale water master fitting. 

Now, please remember I have a Autosleeper 2011 Broadway and I was told my unit was not fitted with a float switch by Autosleeper.

With power disconnected to the whale watermaster inlet and the solenoid disconnected the water went into the tank swiftly. When I used a bench power supply to put 12v on the solenoid the water stopped. The solenoid pulled .75Amp. 

I have seen that others have said that their solenoid valve is normally open as well.

Perhaps I do have a modified filler pre the float switch and the pressure of the water activates the solenoid that is permanently activated on my setup if the tank gets a full from the whale water master.

Tomorrow I will call the UK imported of the solenoid valve to see if they sold a Normally Open unit.
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Post by Caraman Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:04 pm

Johnuready wrote:Thanks for all your help. Today I went back to basics and tried filling from the mains pressure into the whale water master fitting. 

Now, please remember I have a Autosleeper 2011 Broadway and I was told my unit was not fitted with a float switch by Autosleeper.

With power disconnected to the whale watermaster inlet and the solenoid disconnected the water went into the tank swiftly. When I used a bench power supply to put 12v on the solenoid the water stopped. The solenoid pulled .75Amp. 

I have seen that others have said that their solenoid valve is normally open as well.

Perhaps I do have a modified filler pre the float switch and the pressure of the water activates the solenoid that is permanently activated on my setup if the tank gets a full from the whale water master.

Tomorrow I will call the UK imported of the solenoid valve to see if they sold a Normally Open unit.
On my 2019 model an 'autofill' button has to be pressed first on the EC700 Control Panel.  If it is not pressed no power will go to the Whale inlet socket and thus the external pump or the solenoid which will remain shut.  When the autofill button is pressed, power goes to the Whale inlet socket which powers the external pump.  The water pressure generated by the pump activates the pressure switch in the Whale inlet socket which allows power to go to the solenoid which opens the valve allowing water to flow into the tank.  The same happens with mains water pressure.  So if the autofill button isn't pressed or if there is no water pressure at the Whale inlet socket, no power goes to the solenoid valve which remains shut.  As I explained earlier, I have removed the solenoid and its valve which makes the pressure switch in the Whale inlet socket redundant.  So any water pressure at the inlet socket will result in water flowing into the tank with the minimum of resistance.
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Post by Johnuready Sun Apr 11, 2021 4:58 pm

Sorry I forgot to say my 2011 Broadway is fitted with the EC328 and does not have the separate fill selection or the auto time out. I’m still thinking that my model and year used a normally open solenoid that was either a step up from a gravity fill or a work around for not having separate control panel control or a float switch. Anybody have an older Broadway that will fill with no power connected?

I’m thinking that my very slow fill was the soleniod operating from the wale watermaster with a faulty pressure sense or faulty switch that powered the solenoid and stopped the flow. My solenoid was getting hot during the original fill.
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Post by Caraman Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:40 pm

Your solenoid valve's blocked filter, which is a common problem, would have been a reason for slow flow.  I think it's likely that your solenoid valve is supposed to work as the current ones do.  When power is going to the solenoid it opens the valve and keeps it open.  This would be why your solenoid was warm whilst filling the tank.  When no power is going to the solenoid the valve is shut so no flow.  That said, it's possible that some debris has found its way past the filter into the valve which is stopping the valve from closing fully or opening fully.  The pressure switch can also be accessed by unscrewing the plate on the outside of the Whale inlet socket to check there is no debris there.  The pressure switch has a nylon adjustment screw on the inside face of the inlet socket which needs to be fully out.  It can be removed altogether so that the switch closes at the lowest pressure to energise the solenoid.  I don't think this would be responsible for low flow unless the solenoid is pulsing on and off which it will do if the water pressure is too low or the pressure switch set too high.
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Post by spanner Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:30 pm

Johnuready wrote:
roger7webster wrote:Prior to removing the whale system I replaced the solenoid valve with a pipe . No problem if using the whale hose as this has a flow restrictor in the MH end connctor. Tank just overflows when full.
Roger - my first few weeks last year of having a Motorhome I was filling up on site and over flowing when filling up. I asked Autosleeper why I didn’t have the shut off function ie float, they said it was not fitted to my 2011 Broadway. If that is true I don’t know. Assumed they were correct. Anybody else with a 2011 Broadway with auto shut off?
Our Broadway is a 2013 and there is definitely no float cut off device in the tank.
When the tank is full water escapes from 4 small (3-4mm) holes one on each top corner of the tank, the only thing inside the tank is the small submersible pump and the tips of the level sensors.
I’ve fitted a standard type water inlet which is a very worthwhile improvement.
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