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Rear Box

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Post by Bigplumbs Sun Dec 05, 2021 6:48 am

On ou Auto sleepers Nuevo 2004 We have quite a nice rear bumper fitted with tow hook. I have a tow bar mounted back rack that I will use to carry our inflatable boat rolled up but was interested to know if any one knows what make this rear bumper is and if it can be extended out further as I would like to fit some sort of rear box to putt the small 27kg outboard motor in

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Post by burlingtonboaby Sun Dec 05, 2021 7:48 am

Looks like a Armitage bumper ??, from Ferrybridge Yorks, I haven't checked so could be wrong. up!
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Post by rogerblack Sun Dec 05, 2021 11:24 am

Just a thought but another alternative worth thinking about is a tow-ball mounted load carrier.  We have one for our car and it is used to carry our Honwave SIB and ancillary gear. 

The benefit over extending your existing bumper assembly is that it need only be fitted when required. 

This is the one we have, 

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but others with different size, weight, etc are available. e.g.

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Obviously you'd have to be wary of the total rear loading on your overall weight and handling.

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Post by burlingtonboaby Sun Dec 05, 2021 1:13 pm

I have a Thule easy carrier and back box that connects onto my vans  rear tow bar/ball, lots of good stuff on the Thule website.
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Post by Caraman Sun Dec 05, 2021 1:47 pm

Be careful not to exceed the Nuevo's rear axle MPTLM.  It might only be 1900 kg on the 2004 Nuevo.  Any load behind the rear axle bears down on the rear axle and transfers mass from the front axle onto the rear axle.
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Post by Mike23 Mon Dec 06, 2021 9:09 pm

Hi, I believe the Bumper/Towbar fitted to your A/S Neuvo is made (and are usually fitted) by PWS Engineering , Poole Dorset. I had 2 very similar  bars fitted to M/H's many years ago while I waited. Their bars are well made, robust and made "in-house". I feel sure that PWS could fabricate any part or do any changes you require. Regards
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Post by Bigplumbs Fri Dec 10, 2021 7:43 am

Hello again I have one of these back racks that I will fit on the tow ball should be good to take my blow up boat which is about 40kg


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Post by Caraman Fri Dec 10, 2021 8:12 am

Looks a good bit of kit.  Once fitted and fully loaded for a trip, the van with its occupants and full tanks if that's what you travel with should be taken to a weighbridge to check that none of the MTPLMs are being exceeded and to determine the correct tyre pressures.
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Post by Bigplumbs Fri Dec 10, 2021 2:25 pm

Caraman wrote:Looks a good bit of kit.  Once fitted and fully loaded for a trip, the van with its occupants and full tanks if that's what you travel with should be taken to a weighbridge to check that none of the MTPLMs are being exceeded and to determine the correct tyre pressures.

I think with the Payload the Nuevo can take and the fact that there are only 2 of us on board I am sure with just 40 kg on the Rack that should be fine
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Post by Caraman Fri Dec 10, 2021 3:33 pm

Bigplumbs wrote:
Caraman wrote:Looks a good bit of kit.  Once fitted and fully loaded for a trip, the van with its occupants and full tanks if that's what you travel with should be taken to a weighbridge to check that none of the MTPLMs are being exceeded and to determine the correct tyre pressures.

I think with the Payload the Nuevo can take and the fact that there are only 2 of us on board I am sure with just 40 kg on the Rack that should be fine
You might be missing my point.  I don't doubt that even with your Nuevo's reduced payload (later Nuevos I believe have a larger payload than yours), you will not be exceeding it when fully loaded.  This is easy to estimate without going to a weighbridge.  You can't be so sure though about your axle masses which can only be determined on a weighbridge.  Your rear axle mass is likely to be close to its MTPLM which is why it needs to be checked to ensure you are not exceeding it.  Your front axle mass will be well below its MTPLM but needs to be known so you can determine your front tyre pressures.  Your rear tyre pressures will be their maximum permitted pressure or very close to it.
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Post by Bigplumbs Fri Dec 10, 2021 4:51 pm

Caraman wrote:
Bigplumbs wrote:
Caraman wrote:Looks a good bit of kit.  Once fitted and fully loaded for a trip, the van with its occupants and full tanks if that's what you travel with should be taken to a weighbridge to check that none of the MTPLMs are being exceeded and to determine the correct tyre pressures.

I think with the Payload the Nuevo can take and the fact that there are only 2 of us on board I am sure with just 40 kg on the Rack that should be fine
You might be missing my point.  I don't doubt that even with your Nuevo's reduced payload (later Nuevos I believe have a larger payload than yours), you will not be exceeding it when fully loaded.  This is easy to estimate without going to a weighbridge.  You can't be so sure though about your axle masses which can only be determined on a weighbridge.  Your rear axle mass is likely to be close to its MTPLM which is why it needs to be checked to ensure you are not exceeding it.  Your front axle mass will be well below its MTPLM but needs to be known so you can determine your front tyre pressures.  Your rear tyre pressures will be their maximum permitted pressure or very close to it.

No not missing your point I understand about leverage etc. I work with Engineers all the time. I just think rushing off to a weigh bridge is a tad over the top so wont be doing that any time soon.
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Post by jwells Fri Dec 10, 2021 8:01 pm

We had a problem with our Nuevo back axle weight just with 2 bikes on a back rack! Loaded up for long trip around Europe had to do a rethink on packing/distribution. Weighbridge was the only safe weigh!!! Suprising how little you can carry aft!
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Post by Bigplumbs Sat Dec 11, 2021 7:14 am

jwells wrote:We had a problem with our Nuevo back axle weight just with 2 bikes on a back rack! Loaded up for long trip around Europe had to do a rethink on packing/distribution. Weighbridge was the only safe weigh!!! Suprising how little you can carry aft!

I will compensate by carrying more weight up front or just use my Erde trailer which would be more secure. So much to think about

How did the problems you encountered manifest themselves
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Post by Caraman Sat Dec 11, 2021 8:02 am

The main problem is that the law is being broken if any of the MPTLMs are exceeded.  As I have previously said, the only way of being sure they are not exceeded is by taking the van to a weighbridge when it is fully loaded for a trip, which is what all responsible and law abiding owners should do.
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Post by Bigplumbs Sat Dec 11, 2021 11:39 am

Caraman wrote:The main problem is that the law is being broken if any of the MPTLMs are exceeded.  As I have previously said, the only way of being sure they are not exceeded is by taking the van to a weighbridge when it is fully loaded for a trip, which is what all responsible and law abiding owners should do.

I always think it is important not to Preach to others. 

I think it is also important to think about the practicalities of going to a weighbridge before you set out on your trip

Any way I think we might be in danger of a little thread drift if not careful into areas best left alone
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Post by Mike23 Sat Dec 11, 2021 12:39 pm

Hi, With reference to "thread drift ", I understood the O.P to be asking for advice regarding make of towbar and if it could be altered to suit your additional requirements. Regards
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Post by Bigplumbs Sat Dec 11, 2021 6:05 pm

Mike23 wrote:Hi, With reference to "thread drift ", I understood the O.P to be asking for advice regarding make of towbar and if it could be altered to suit your additional requirements. Regards


That was indeed my question
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Post by jwells Sat Dec 11, 2021 9:28 pm

We were actually advised not to fit a towbar when we bought our Nuevo because of the rear weight loading problem.
There is a very large moment arm behind the rear axle, and I even ended up removing the pointless steadies, every little bit helps!!
You asked, ''How did the problems you encountered manifest themselves'', fully loaded ready to go when I took it to a weighbridge to check it!
Nothing else useful to add. Do you even know what weight you have at the moment?
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Post by Bigplumbs Sun Dec 12, 2021 7:38 am

jwells wrote:We were actually advised not to fit a towbar when we bought our Nuevo because of the rear weight loading problem.
There is a very large moment arm behind the rear axle, and I even ended up removing the pointless steadies, every little bit helps!!
You asked, ''How did the problems you encountered manifest themselves'', fully loaded ready to go when I took it to a weighbridge to check it!
Nothing else useful to add. Do you even know what weight you have at the moment?

So there was no problem necessarily. Did it drive and handle ok.

Can’t see how a tow bar towing a trailer could be a problem.

Some people sadly like to weigh, measure, investigate and in effect create their own worry and perceived problems. I have never done that and never will.

As to the weight I know on my Nuevo their is plenty of payload left so no need to stress unless of course people afflicted with OCD try to afflict others with their illness 

Chill and enjoy your van
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Post by Caraman Sun Dec 12, 2021 7:54 am

Bigplumbs wrote:
Caraman wrote:The main problem is that the law is being broken if any of the MPTLMs are exceeded.  As I have previously said, the only way of being sure they are not exceeded is by taking the van to a weighbridge when it is fully loaded for a trip, which is what all responsible and law abiding owners should do.

I always think it is important not to Preach to others. 

I think it is also important to think about the practicalities of going to a weighbridge before you set out on your trip

Any way I think we might be in danger of a little thread drift if not careful into areas best left alone
The DVLA database shows that your vehicle (AU54GVM) has a Revenue weight of 3300 kg.  This means that your rear axle MTPLM is only 1900 kg.  In your first post you have proposed increasing the weight of your existing after market tow bar by extending it and then fitting a luggage rack to it so you can carry an inflatable dinghy and outboard motor in it.  The advice I have given about the impact this will have on your rear axle mass and the need to measure your rear axle mass on a weighbridge is not off topic in any way.  

There is nothing impracticable about going to a weighbridge once your motorhome is at its maximum load for a trip.  It usually only has to be done once and its what I am sure the majority of motorhome owners do.

I am sorry if you regard this as preaching but its what I will continue to do if I think it is warranted which I do in your case.
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Post by Bigplumbs Sun Dec 12, 2021 8:05 am

Caraman wrote:
Bigplumbs wrote:
Caraman wrote:The main problem is that the law is being broken if any of the MPTLMs are exceeded.  As I have previously said, the only way of being sure they are not exceeded is by taking the van to a weighbridge when it is fully loaded for a trip, which is what all responsible and law abiding owners should do.

I always think it is important not to Preach to others. 

I think it is also important to think about the practicalities of going to a weighbridge before you set out on your trip

Any way I think we might be in danger of a little thread drift if not careful into areas best left alone
The DVLA database shows that your vehicle (AU54GVM) has a Revenue weight of 3300 kg.  This means that your rear axle MTPLM is only 1900 kg.  In your first post you have proposed increasing the weight of your existing after market tow bar by extending it and then fitting a luggage rack to it so you can carry an inflatable dinghy and outboard motor in it.  The advice I have given about the impact this will have on your rear axle mass and the need to measure your rear axle mass on a weighbridge is not off topic in any way.  

There is nothing impracticable about going to a weighbridge once your motorhome is at its maximum load for a trip.  It usually only has to be done once and its what I am sure the majority of motorhome owners do.

I am sorry if you regard this as preaching but its what I will continue to do if I think it is warranted which I do in your case.
Oh dear you could not help your self. 

And thanks but not interested in your preaching


Last edited by Bigplumbs on Sun Dec 12, 2021 8:13 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Bigplumbs Sun Dec 12, 2021 8:13 am

Caravan

Having accepted that you are preaching I wonder what you think gives you that right. Assuming you know better than others when you know nothing about them is interesting don’t you think

Happy Christmas

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Post by Tinwheeler Sun Dec 12, 2021 9:32 am

If not interested in the helpful advice offered, would it not be friendlier to simply offer thanks and move on?
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Post by Bigplumbs Sun Dec 12, 2021 9:40 am

Tinwheeler wrote:If not interested in the helpful advice offered, would it not be friendlier to simply offer thanks and move on?

If the person giving the 'advice' in effect accuses you of being non law abiding and irresponsible perhaps they need challenging and are themselves not being friendly.

I firmly believe that offering thanks for something that you don't believe is quite wrong. When this is done the incorrect and sometimes dangerous message can be condoned and remain unchallenged. 

Hiding in the shadows and not speaking my mind will never be my way. I will always try to do this in a friendly way provided I receive the same in return.

Many thanks for what I am sure you intended to be helpful advice.  smile!
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Post by Tinwheeler Sun Dec 12, 2021 10:20 am

I saw no accusations - only advice to keep you safe and law abiding for which thanks would not have been out of place.

I'm leaving it there. Time to let go.
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