filling van with water

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Re: filling van with water

Post by Peter Brown on Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:18 pm

Gromit wrote:Try the link now Starlight. (I don't know why it won't work in Ron's post, as the forum won't let me use HTML to check the syntax.)

http://www.auto-sleepers.com/media/2014/12/Surrey-Northants-2009-handbook.pdf

It works for me now. If you still can't open it I'll have another look. smile!

As for the irritating pump - we have the tee shirt!!! I think everything has been covered, but ours seemed far more stable while on hook-up. Once I had adjusted the pressure switch it was OK until we came off hook-up. Apparently the pressure switch and/or pump is very sensitive to voltage, and as the battery slowly runs down the censored! pump starts playing up.

I don't know if this will help. As chronicled elsewhere on here, ours was such a pain in the rear (not just running at intervals like yours) that we got a Shurflo fitted. Absolute perfection ever since!! up!

The link is to the wrong handbook.  Try this, page 7-3 http://www.auto-sleepers.com/media/2014/12/Bourton-2016-handbook.pdf

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Re: filling van with water

Post by inspiredron on Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:40 pm

No - I cannot open it either - Sorry I did not check  rolleyes .  Initially I inserted the generic handbooks link that covers all models but then, having opened the 2009 + Bourton handbook I simply copied and pasted the url from the addres line in Firefox. Normally works and I think tha tthe syntax is exactly like Dave's so .......? confused3

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Re: filling van with water

Post by Peter Brown on Sun Apr 23, 2017 2:54 pm

inspiredron wrote:No - I cannot open it either - Sorry I did not check  rolleyes .  Initially I inserted the generic handbooks link that covers all models but then, having opened the 2009 + Bourton handbook I simply copied and pasted the url from the addres line in Firefox. Normally works and I think tha tthe syntax is exactly like Dave's so .......? confused3

Ron, the link you actually put in (didn't work) but was to the Surrey/Northants handbook with a diaphragm pump.

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Re: filling van with water

Post by inspiredron on Sun Apr 23, 2017 3:12 pm

That is totally wierd?  I am totally sure thatI clicked on a Bourton 2009 link on the generic page.  When it opened I saw that it covered Surrey Northants and assumed that was a generic (close enough on A/S terms) and also saw that it was a diaphragm pump.  Now, on the global handbooks archive I don't see Bourton 2009!
I was updating a Garmin map at the time so .........?  Sorry if I just caused confusion.

Anyway, the OP has a handbook and has tried to adjustthe pressure switch in accordance with the instructions - which have always workd for me.
Last time out (September) I spent some time with fine adjustments and noticed no phantom running on ot off hook-up.

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Re: filling van with water

Post by PLOUGHLIN on Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:27 pm

Many of the Handbook links on the AS handbook page link to the Surrey/Northants model not the one in the click box.

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Re: filling van with water

Post by inspiredron on Sun Apr 23, 2017 6:51 pm

I have just spent a happy (?) half hour filling my van with water as part preparation at the start of my season.
A week or two ago I removed, with some difficulty, the cap on the bottom of my fresh water tank to clean the sensors which had been U/S at the end of last season. The orifice is less than 4 inches diameter but I could JUST get my lower arm and elbow through. At full stretch I could feel the lowest four studs and managed to wipe them ineffectively (as I thought) with a new green Scotchbrite.  I replaced the cap (without any sealant) and hoped for the best.  I had reached the bottom stud (earth return) easier than the 0%, 25% and 50% but hoped that might be the most important.
Putting in water today (with my Whale filler) I was heartened to see 25%, 50$ and then 75% all come up on the panel in less than 5 minutes - at which point I stopped - a happy man.
Now to check the pump and pressure switch.  Switch off the drain valve for the boiler.
Disconnect Whale and switch on the water pump. As expected it whined immediately and carried on running. Open sink tap switched to COLD.  Air and then a good run of water.  Repeat in bathroom with same result.  Switch bathroom tap to HOT - LOTS of air followed by feeble water flow.  Repeat at sink with same result and in both cases pump will not turn off!
Then indicator bleeps to show water is 0%.  I turn off pump and can hear water running outside.  Check to find that it is pouring our around water tank.  Scratch head?   Did I turn off the drain valve properly?  Open it again and THIS TIME I REMEMBER TO PRESS THE BUTTON IN AND KEEP IT IN WHILE I TURN THE VALVE OFF!!!
Refill tank to 75% and repeat hot bleeding operation.  This time I get better hot flow and the pump switches off as it should - and there is no leak.

SO -MY VOTE -  Whale system 10/10,  Operator 3/10, losing 7 marks for wasting around 20 minutes of the half hour total time.

Starlight:  A possible thing to check as your pump is repressurising too often.  Open that drain valve to let some water out and then close it again (WHILE PRESSING THE BUTTON!).  It is just possible that there is a small amount of debris which is preventing it from closing properly at the moment and you would be unlkely to notice the leak as it drips around the tank. Flushing it may get rid of the debris.


Last edited by inspiredron on Sun Apr 23, 2017 6:56 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Minor additions & corrections)

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Re: filling van with water

Post by Starlight on Mon Apr 24, 2017 9:23 pm

Hi. I've opened the link and got the attachment. I have the manual with me and have followed it to the letter.  I must have a plumbing leak.  Every 40 seconds it buzzes for 5 seconds.
I have discovered that the drain pipe from the tank is leaking, just a drip but from the tank connection not the blue plastic valve.  AS helpline have devised I need to drop the tank to get to the locknut inside the tank.  It will need to wait till I get back.  What a pain!
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Re: filling van with water

Post by PLOUGHLIN on Mon Apr 24, 2017 10:52 pm

A leak from the drain pipe of the tank will not cause the pump problem.

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Re: filling van with water

Post by inspiredron on Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:58 pm

I think that the pipe which draws water from the tank is in two parts which are joined by a connector that is held on to the tank side by a nut either side. Maybe there is a leak there, inside or out?

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Re: filling van with water

Post by Starlight on Sat Apr 29, 2017 2:25 am

I wonder if my pressure switch is working as it should? Could this be the problem?  I tried letting some water flow from the drain valve with the button and switching that off just to be sure. Saw the water release under the van but still no evidence of a water leak inside or outside the van. Have been parked on dry Tarmac so I would have noticed! Apart from the drip from the tank connection to the drain valve that A/S advise that I need to drop the tank to access the nut inside to tighten this to cure the leak.  I understand this is not connected with the pump constantly cutting in. I've tried adjusting the pressure switch but still it keeps cutting in every minute for a few seconds.  
This issue has me beat and I think I'll have to resort to Marquis to resolve this.  I hope it's not "operator error"!  First time abroad in my van will be remembered for this constant intermittant buzz of the water pump. 
The waste water gauge is also constantly showing 100% full.  But that's another story!
Glad to say that everything else is working fine.
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Re: filling van with water

Post by Jaytee on Sat Apr 29, 2017 10:41 am

Just a thought and possibly way off track but is there a non return valve in the system that stops the pressure bleeding back? If that were not shutting off fully it would allow pressure back into the tank without any signs of a leak.

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Re: filling van with water

Post by kaspian on Sat Apr 29, 2017 11:22 am

What Jaytee says is correct , the whaie pump in the tank does not sustain the pressure in the system , it is just an impeller driven by a small motor and when power switches off water would flow back into the tank. There should normally be a one way valve either incorporated in the pressure switch or just before . A small bit of grit could be causing the valve to not seal correctly allowing  water to bleed back into the tank which then drops the pressure starting the pump again .So in effect it switches on every few moments to build up  pressure  again. No leak would be seen as water returns via pipework to the tank.Easy job to remove and blow through and ensure a good seal . ( you can only blow through in one direction obviously)

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Re: filling van with water

Post by Starlight on Sat Apr 29, 2017 11:38 am

Jagged & Kaspian
This sounds like the problem I have.  Now all I need to do is locate the non return valve!?  If I switch off the electrics the system seems to drain back into the tank.  Once switched on again I have air in the hot taps!!
I'll search for the non return valve!
Thanks for your replies.
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Re: filling van with water

Post by Starlight on Sat Apr 29, 2017 1:02 pm

Jaytee
I have located the non return valve that is part of the pressure switch.  This could be my problem.  I'm loathed to strip it down here in France as knowing my luck I'll need a new switch rather than a service kit.  I hope this is the problem.  It could just be a simple job! (With the right spares!)
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Re: filling van with water

Post by kaspian on Sat Apr 29, 2017 1:38 pm

The one way valve is normally very simple ie a small rubber disc covering the input pipe held in place with light spring pressure , very little to go wrong , perhaps a but of grit/ dirt stopping it sealing correctly.

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Re: filling van with water

Post by Jaytee on Sat Apr 29, 2017 2:51 pm

Starlight wrote:Jaytee
I have located the non return valve that is part of the pressure switch.  This could be my problem.  I'm loathed to strip it down here in France as knowing my luck I'll need a new switch rather than a service kit.  I hope this is the problem.  It could just be a simple job! (With the right spares!)
Fingers crossed  up!

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Re: filling van with water

Post by Starlight on Wed May 03, 2017 5:54 pm

I've been in touch with Whale Pumps who have advised the pressure switch is still under warranty!  Dealer did FOC....Result!
Perhaps they will sort my water tank leak and the waste water gauge at the same time!! Look out Marquis, here I come!
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Re: filling van with water

Post by kaspian on Wed May 03, 2017 7:39 pm

Starlight wrote:I've been in touch with Whale Pumps who have advised the pressure switch is still under warranty!  Dealer did FOC....Result!
Perhaps they will sort my water tank leak and the waste water gauge at the same time!! Look out Marquis, here I come!
Sweet, good old Whale honour a warranty, excellent.  With a motorhome like Autosleeper its not often you win one but it must be sweet when you do ! Just glad we pointed you in the right direction. Well done. up!

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Re: filling van with water

Post by Starlight on Wed May 03, 2017 8:56 pm

Thanks to you all for your words of wisdom.
Much appreciated but I wonder why this was not picked up at the last habitation service?
I hope it won't be too much hassle to get Marquis to undertake the works.
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Re: filling van with water

Post by Starlight on Fri May 05, 2017 9:51 pm

Having spent 3 weeks living with a buzzing pump, caused by a defective non return valve in the pressure switch, Whale have advised its a warranted claim and get the dealer to sort.  Well, I've now been told that Marquis need to diagnose the fault but the is a charge of £78/hr.  I wonder how much a new pressure switch is?
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Re: filling van with water

Post by Gromit on Sat May 06, 2017 9:35 am

kaspian wrote:
 With a motorhome like Autosleeper its not often you win one but it must be sweet when you do !
Sell it and buy a Elddis then Kaspian, or one of those foreign marques that have never been known to have the slightest problem since the dawn of time!! Whistle1

If you are that fed up with it you won't be able to enjoy using it, so the sensible thing would be to get one that you can enjoy. It clearly makes you miserable so you would be better off without it.

I do know where you are coming from too. We bought a new car six months ago, and Mrs Gromit didn't like it at all once she had driven it a few times. No point in arguing or procrastinating - we got the new version of our "old" car last week. The world is now a happy place. (Well, my bit of it anyway!   courtesy )

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Re: filling van with water

Post by kaspian on Sat May 06, 2017 11:15 pm

QUOTE....Sell it and buy a Elddis then Kaspian, or one of those foreign marques that have never been known to have the slightest problem since the dawn of time!! 

Hi
 Dave , had 3 and all 3 added together never had so much wrong as our current van.At least they honour a generous 10 years water ingress warranty on a coachbuilt not van conversion!
     We bought into the myth of superior build , supreme design and quality, sadly in our and others experience it was not a reality. Unfortunately we are not in the position to throw away £20k and ditch the van. It was bloody hard earned cash saved over a number of years doing humble labours. I am a bit old to command   premiership football wages and dont own any oilwells, sing with the Beatles  or have reserves of gold equal to a Swiss bank.
     Perhaps I should have remembered my position and status and stuck with the 'poor mans ' marque!  (We are not worthy) see (Waynes world)   hugegrins I have heard of the foreign makes that are 100% fault free too! I also believe they get between 60 and 80 mpg without dropping below 130mph on the autobahn but only Iif the driver is over 75 years!...Problem is   we like the layout of our van but are disappointed by the stupid errors in build quality. Wildax make cracking good vans with great reviews and you deal with the owner who seems a genuine honourable guy with vision and passion  but they dont do our layout.
         In reality  It is ALL OUR FAULTS for putting up with less than perfect build and lying under our vans like fools doing work to repair the results of careless build rather than waste  time/ hassle / bother returning constantly to dealers or makers . It amuses me somewhat when we all argue on this forum  over the best way to bodge a fix on someones shower wall that falls off its hinges with minimal use when actually ,after them paying the best part of £65000 , it should be driven straight back and put through the dealers front showroom window ! 
      Maybe its the fault of our British stiff upper lip lying in a puddle in the rain on holiday under a £55k van repairing a bit of brittle £2 hose which burst depositing 60 odd litres of smelly water all over our immaculately manicured grass  pitch , taking perverse delight and desperate to prove we can do better ( MUCH  TO THE ANNOYANCE OF THE SITE OWNERS)
    My experience and others of our marque  on this forum seems imho  to be like Skoda only in reverse. a sort of -ve Skoda perhaps) Skoda started off as a joke car but now make extremely good cars after management got a grip where as...........I'll keep taking the tablets ...Whistle1 Is that the rain on ? Time to look out the tools and get into some van improvement.

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Re: filling van with water

Post by inspiredron on Sat May 06, 2017 11:37 pm

Starlight wrote:Having spent 3 weeks living with a buzzing pump, caused by a defective non return valve in the pressure switch, Whale have advised its a warranted claim and get the dealer to sort.  Well, I've now been told that Marquis need to diagnose the fault but the is a charge of £78/hr.  I wonder how much a new pressure switch is?
Whale are very good on customer relations - If you speak nicely they will send you a new pressure switch to fit yourself!  Tell them that Marquis want £78 an hour to diagnose what Whale have told you.

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Re: filling van with water

Post by kaspian on Sun May 07, 2017 12:07 am

inspiredron wrote:
Starlight wrote:Having spent 3 weeks living with a buzzing pump, caused by a defective non return valve in the pressure switch, Whale have advised its a warranted claim and get the dealer to sort.  Well, I've now been told that Marquis need to diagnose the fault but the is a charge of £78/hr.  I wonder how much a new pressure switch is?
Whale are very good on customer relations - If you speak nicely they will send you a new pressure switch to fit yourself!  Tell them that Marquis want £78 an hour to diagnose what Whale have told you.
 2nd that Ron , Whale are very good with customer problems . Could this be partly why warranty claims are down  ? Make it so difficult/ costly to claim? See previous post re diy repairs - says it all really!

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Re: filling van with water

Post by Gromit on Sun May 07, 2017 9:15 am

Hi Kaspian
I'm glad you were polite about Skoda, or it would have been handbags at dawn. That's what we got last week - our fifth to date. allthumbz

Now - a bit of elementary logic dear Watson. I think you and everyone else who expects near perfection because they have paid loads of dosh for a van, are talking a load of doughnuts. The exact opposite is true - you should expect more problems, not less!! scratch head

Simple really. The higher the cost the more fancy appliances, gadgets and gizmos you get, each one of which has the potential to go wrong and cause problems. Add to that the fact that each one is fitted by humans, not robots, and there's an equal potential for them to be fitted incorrectly. Double jeopardy if you like.

(Please don't jump on Autosleepers from too great a height on that last point, as I'm sure they are no worse than anyone else. Ask any motorhome service engineer. They would be out of a job if the factories built vans as well as they should!! shrugg )

OK this is a bit tongue in cheek, but not entirely so. Modern vans embrace the direct opposite of the KISS principle, as they try to seduce potential buyers with all the latest "must have" functions and features, all the while having to stay below the 3500kg limit - otherwise they exclude 90% of those buyers. Add to that the vicious competition to beat their rivals on price, and you have a conundrum.

The fact that more things are likely to go wrong with a modern van is a self fulfilling prophesy, and I haven't even mentioned the workforce and their pride in the job, or lack of it these days!! censored!

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