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Considering getting a Broadway

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Considering getting a Broadway  Empty Considering getting a Broadway

Post by Toffee Tue Oct 10, 2023 7:46 pm

I am looking for some pointers, I am considering swapping our 2016 PVC for a Broadway of a similar age, is there anything I should look for in terms of common issues I have my eye on an EKTBLP but also looking a pictures would also be interested in views on the end lounge model. 
I have read in the past about stress fractures on coach builds and also possible damp due to the construction methods, but I cannot recall if this relates to the Broadway.

My PVC is in excellent condition and I am concerned after spending money to switch I might be worse off.

Thanks
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Post by IanH Tue Oct 10, 2023 8:42 pm

Know nothing about Broadways but fair bit re PVC's

For me the most critical physical dimension of any motorhome is width.

The Broadway is nearly 300 mm wider than the PVC's.

Depends where you go and how you use your van but, for me that alone would be a stopper. Narrow villages, effectively unusable on, say, the Wild Atlantic Way in Ireland, all the sorts of places we like to use ours.
Your needs or uses may, of course, be totally different, that's just my feeling.

As a coachbuilt it may suffer from damp which is very rare in PVC's????
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Post by Caraman Wed Oct 11, 2023 4:09 pm

The Broadway EKTBLP and Fairford are like chalk and cheese.  I'll focus on mass.  The 3500 kg Broadway boasts a user loading margin of 481 kg which is 57 kg more than the 3500 kg Fairford but this is not the whole story.  The Broadway's rear axle loading margin is only 384 kg which is 520 kg less than the Fairford.  This is for two reason.  The Broadway's rear axle MTPLM is 2000 kg whereas the Fairford's is 2400 kg and the Broadway's long rear overhang makes it rear heavy before it's loaded and even more rear heavy when it's loaded.  The so what is that you may not be able to use all of the Broadway's extra storage space or all of its loading margin without exceeding or getting perilously close to its rear axle limit.  Tyre manufacturers and TyreSafe recommend that an axle mass does not exceed 90% of the maximum permitted load of its two tyres.  If this recommendation is applied to the Broadway EKTBLP which, like my like my Nuevo EKTBLP, only has 109 load indexed tyres, it reduces the rear axle loading margin by 146 kg making the rear axle mass even more critical.
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Post by Toffee Wed Oct 11, 2023 7:43 pm

Thanks caraman I had wondered about weight, i enquired about uprating the Broadway and was told 3650 maximum, the fairford is plated at 3900 due to a tow bar and heavy bikes.
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Post by Caraman Thu Oct 12, 2023 7:27 am

Toffee wrote:Thanks caraman I had wondered about weight, i enquired about uprating the Broadway and was told 3650 maximum, the fairford is plated at 3900 due to a tow bar and heavy bikes.
If you want to be able to travel with full or nearly full water tanks (to cover wild camping) and/or heavy bikes on the back perhaps mounted on a tow bar you will almost certainly need to find an up-plated Broadway with 225/70 R15 112 CP tyres rather than the standard 215/70 R15 109 CP tyres.  There is a thread somewhere about someone who bought a new Broadway and then had to up-plate and fit new tyres so he could accommodate bikes on a tow bar.
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Post by Toffee Thu Oct 12, 2023 8:12 am

I was expecting to have to up-plate the vehicle I think as this thread is playing out I’m being steered to considering a different pvc or sticking with what we have.
On another note, I’ve got it in mind that European break down cover is unobtainable on vehicles over 10 years old is this correct?
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Post by PLOUGHLIN Thu Oct 12, 2023 8:59 am

Toffee wrote:I was expecting to have to up-plate the vehicle I think as this thread is playing out I’m being steered to considering a different pvc or sticking with what we have.
On another note, I’ve got it in mind that European break down cover is unobtainable on vehicles over 10 years old is this correct?

My Comfort Breakdown cover is European wide, 12 year old Gloucester.

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Post by Caraman Thu Oct 12, 2023 11:01 am

Toffee wrote:I was expecting to have to up-plate the vehicle I think as this thread is playing out I’m being steered to considering a different pvc or sticking with what we have.
...
I wasn't trying to put you off the Broadway.  We have the SWB version which is the Nuevo and are very happy with it.  But we only drive it from site to site, via a supermarket or NT carpark, with the equivalent to two light bikes on the back and with empty or near empty fresh, grey and black water tanks.  It's comfortable and cosy which allows us to use it all year but we are cautious using grass pitches as the front wheel traction is not good.  As mentioned it has the width of a caravan which can lead to scratches from hedgerows but due to its short wheel base it has a tight turning circle.
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Post by IanH Thu Oct 12, 2023 11:22 am

My breakdown cover is Europe wide, recovery to here, they know the van size, mine's 21 yrs old and they also know that.

Think, though not my decision, the best plan is stick with what you have!
One, you know its faults
Two, you know its recent, at least, history
Three, already modified to take your heavy bikes
Four, it won't leak when it rains!!

Anything you buy to replace it may be absolutely perfect, but equally likely to be a total nightmare....

I like my Exec, have had newer, indeed, 2 x Warwick Duos, both of which I also liked, but it is old enough to avoid all the bad things new vehicles have....ECU, EGR, DPF, Ad Blu, I could go on. Best of all it has nothing with Sargent written on it anywhere!!!

Your toy, your call!! up!


Last edited by IanH on Thu Oct 12, 2023 1:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by glyne lock Thu Oct 12, 2023 12:57 pm

IanH 
Could you not have put lovely Sargent   [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
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Post by IanH Thu Oct 12, 2023 1:09 pm

No!
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Post by Firedecisions Thu Oct 12, 2023 6:41 pm

We have a Broadway End Bathroom, no major issues with it and we love it, had it for 3 years from new
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Post by cobs Fri Oct 13, 2023 7:25 am

We also have a Broadway EB, similar age. Setting off for a week in Wales, called in at the weighbridge and was bang on 3500kg. This was with full water, diesel, gas, toilet tank filled, luggage, chairs etc and two bikes on the back. From memory, rear axle about 1950, front about 1550.
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Post by Caraman Fri Oct 13, 2023 2:23 pm

We've just started a 2-week trip to the North of England and left home this morning with our LP Nuevo via our local weigh bridge.  Front axle 1400 kg, rear axle 1900 kg, total 3300 kg.  This was with full tanks incl. AdBlue, windscreen washer, fuel, LPG, hot water tank and a small handheld container inside the van but excluded the fresh, grey and black water tanks which were empty.  We were carrying food & drink for 4 days, a full fridge, and clothes for 2 weeks incl. for walking & cycling.  On the rear bike rack we had one bike, 2 outdoor chairs, covers and a lighting board.  Our Nuevo has an Autolift4 levelling system.  

The 1900 kg for the rear axle is more than I would like.  TyreSafe and tyre manufacturers recommend for my 109 load rated tyres it should be no more than 1854 kg. I would be concerned if it was as high as 1950 kg.
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Post by cobs Fri Oct 13, 2023 2:42 pm

Have replaced tyres with 225/70 which have higher load rating. Am also thinking about semi-air which means I could up-plate if necessary in future
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Post by Caraman Fri Oct 13, 2023 3:07 pm

cobs wrote:Have replaced tyres with 225/70 which have higher load rating.  Am also thinking about semi-air which means I could up-plate if necessary in future
I am thinking of replacing my 215/70 tyres with 225/70s as you have done with a higher load rating.  A stupid question but did the wider tyres fit the Broadway and existing rims OK?  Did you notice any change in handling, ride, economy, noise or traction?
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Post by cobs Fri Oct 13, 2023 4:02 pm

No real change in any of these, though in fairness they were changed early on in the van's life due to a blowout. New ones are Agilis Cross climate. One advantage of non camper tyres is that you're not limited to the 80psi pressures. A disadvantage is that they are directional. For this reason I've kept the original camper spare for use in an emergency.
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Post by Caraman Fri Oct 13, 2023 4:27 pm

I will stay with CP.  As I understand it, a CP tyre can be run at an equivalent C tyre's lower pressure but most of the safety benefits of having the CP tyre will be lost.  For my current axle masses and tyres, I use 3.30 bar front and 5.50 bar rear.  These are the ETRTO pressures for an axle mass that is up to 10% higher.  If I change to 225s, I should be able to reduce these pressures to 3.00 bar front and 5.05 bar rear whilst retaining all the benefits of a CP tyre.  Anything that reduces the risk of a blowout gets my vote.
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Post by Peter Brown Fri Oct 13, 2023 5:40 pm

We have 2016 Broadway EB.  Loads of storage space, brilliant bathroom, tow bar fitted.  With two up, fuel and water tanks full and all kit for a long trip in the van it weighed in at front 1560kg, back 1860kg and total 3440 kg.  I didn't have bike rack or bikes on but it would be very rare to have both fuel and water tanks full so I estimate about 150kg spare.

No problem with size as had much bigger vans for the previous 15 years.
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Post by The Bargee Fri Oct 13, 2023 8:40 pm

I have been concerned about traction (being a lifelong 4x4 person) and we did get the Kingham stuck once on the top of the Pennines. Also I have become really tired of the ghastly bumpy crashing ride over potholes and bad roads on the original Contivan C tyres.

Last week I threw these away and fitted a set of General Grabber AT3's, 235/65 R16C with 121 load rating. I was going to give it another week or so before commenting on these but I have done about 500 miles now including a very blustery run down to Falmouth this afternoon, and can only say I am really pleased so far. The ride is transformed, the tracking was rock steady in strong cross winds and we had a very smooth trip indeed with far less noise inside the van. I will be beetling round some Cornish lanes this next week so will have a better idea after that but so far I think that these tyres are likely to be perfect. No soft grass trials yet but I am sure they will give a lot more traction than the original tyres, which although only part worn (13,000 miles) looked more like slicks apart from the three plain grooves in the tread.

More to the point of this post the 121 load rating would go a long way to solving many weight issues. I am reluctantly considering up plating to 3,900kg since we are teetering on the 3.5 limit at the moment, and with these GG tyres there is no problem. Even without up plating they allow a much greater margin of capacity.

The only down side might be fuel consumption, but I don't actually know accurately what the van was doing beforehand so I won't have to worry about that! More seriously, I put GG AT3's on my VW Touareg at the same time (expensive week!) and so far after 800 miles in that car I can't see any significant change in consumption (or tyre noise for that matter.)
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Post by Toffee Sat Oct 14, 2023 7:43 am

I never new these tyres existed, we opted for Michelin cross climate in our fairford 118-116 rated and we are plated at 3900, had to supply proof of the load rating as part up the uprating process. I’ve not regretted the change from 3500kgs. The cross climate tyres don’t seem to have effected the fuel consumption, I doubt your General Grabbers will either.

Back to our thoughts on getting a Broadway thanks to all who have contributed the posts have all been useful and from lots of perspectives. 
The Broadway we were considering is exactly the same age as the fairford we own, if we bought it it would be for at least 5 years intended ownership at which point it would be.12 years old.
 I can’t decide which of the two would be the most sustainable option. I use the term sustainable in terms of longevity and cost of maintaining it to a useable standard up to and possibly beyond this period. I suspect the pvc will be corroded and the the coachbuilt will be leaking.
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Post by The Bargee Sat Oct 14, 2023 8:28 am

Toffee wrote:I never new these tyres existed, we opted for Michelin cross climate in our fairford 118-116 rated and we are plated at 3900, had to supply proof of the load rating as part up the uprating process. I’ve not regretted the change from 3500kgs. The cross climate tyres don’t seem to have effected the fuel consumption, I doubt your General Grabbers will either.

Back to our thoughts on getting a Broadway thanks to all who have contributed the posts have all been useful and from lots of perspectives. 
The Broadway we were considering is exactly the same age as the fairford we own, if we bought it it would be for at least 5 years intended ownership at which point it would be.12 years old.
 I can’t decide which of the two would be the most sustainable option. I use the term sustainable in terms of longevity and cost of maintaining it to a useable standard up to and possibly beyond this period. I suspect the pvc will be corroded and the the coachbuilt will be leaking.

It does sound a bit like "out of the frying pan........

I think IanH raised the point that would concern me the most, namely the extra width. That of course depends an awful lot on how you use your van but if you tour with it as we do then the width could be a big issue in the more scenic areas that one might be visiting. I find the PVC to be effectively as easy to drive in lanes as using my (rather fat) SUV. The only downside is the need to think a little bit more about where and how you park due to the length, but you will know all that already. If anybody were to complain when squeezing past in a small lane I would just remind them that the van is the same as the van that delivers their parcels!

When we chose our van I did not even look at coachbuilts. I did not want the extra width and the greater risk of body damage, even though that does mean that the bed is rather narrow! I wanted a van that would go anywhere that an Amazon van could.

When all said and done your van is not that old, and won't be that old in 5 years time. Presumably it is a zinc coated body.
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Post by Caraman Sat Oct 14, 2023 9:06 am

I doubt there is any significant difference in sustainability except that the Broadway is likely to have a lower milage.  Corrosion is usually on the underside which will probably affect both types of van equally.  Over 30+ years we've owned 3 caravans with different layouts and now the Nuevo, all from new.  Maybe we were lucky but we always found each van suited us perfectly.  The only reason for change was a change in our requirement as our family grew up and left home and we retired.  If you're happy with your current van and your requirement hasn't changed, I would stick with what you've got.
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Post by Plymouthwelshboy Sun Oct 22, 2023 8:33 pm

I'm the guy who had to up plate the Broadway....new tow bar and e bikes put it over the rear axle weight. We had to put in semi air suspension and change tyres to what caraman said above. All the changes were worth it. We were also able to add new solar panels and two new batteries. We can now off grid quite happily with full tanks of water and fuel.
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Post by BornAgain Sun Oct 22, 2023 9:31 pm

We had an EKTBLP for five years but sold it when it got a damp problem which I hadn’t realised was an issue with Coachbuilts although we had many such problems with caravans. Fortunately it was still under the original AS warranty which is not transferable and something to be aware of if buying secondhand. 
We then bought a Bourton and being a Mercedes base vehicle is a far superior drive and ride if you can afford one.
We sold it back to the dealer after a few months due to a number of problems including a complete failure of the Truma system so having to travel through France for 4 weeks with no heating or hot water. Lithium battery had problems and there were several other faults.

We are now probably going to downsize to a PVC as being more manageable and hopefully without damp problems. Not keen on any of the AS models which don’t seem to have moved with the times but we shall see.
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