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Whale Watermaster Mains

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Post by Jaanca Mon Jul 03, 2023 5:57 pm

Hi, I have searched but can't see a solution for this one.
The water master connects to the Whale fitting on my Symbol. The other end is connected to a tap.
After connecting the whale plug and turning the 12v electrics on there is no water going into the freshwater tank.
I have cleaned the filter in the solenoid. I ran a 12v supply from the battery directly to the solenoid and the tank started to fill.
There doesn't seem to be a separate fuse for the solenoid. Could it be the tank sensor? Does anyone know how the system works?

Thanks
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Post by Tinwheeler Mon Jul 03, 2023 6:56 pm

I’m sure somebody will be able to help but it will be good if you introduce yourself as per the instructions to new members while you’re waiting.
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Post by inspiredron Mon Jul 03, 2023 11:07 pm

As you have already discovered getting water into the tank via the Whale inlet relies on power being supplied to the solenoid valve mounted just below the Whale inlet. Power to that solenoid comes from the leisure electrics which must be switched on. Power then comes via a levels of switch which opens when the freshwater tank is full. If that switch is faulty then no power will reach the solenoid valve. As far as I know that circuit does not have a separate fuse. Your Sargent unit should have a setting for water pumps Internal, External or Both. Mine is set to Both.

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Post by v8oholic Tue Jul 04, 2023 7:08 am

Yours is a different age so may work differently to my EC700 version, but on mine you have to go into the settings screen and enable automatic tank fill. It looks like on-off but it actually has 3 values. From memory one is blue and the other green, and it only fills on one of those two settings. I don’t really know how it works, I just tap it until something happens.
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Post by Caraman Tue Jul 04, 2023 9:41 am

Jaanca - your model is earlier than mine.  On my later EC700 the Whale inlet socket pressure switch, solenoid valve and external Whale pump if fitted is powered via the No 5 5 Amps Tan coloured fuse titled 'Appliances' in the Handbook.  Yours will be covered by a fuse so worth checking this.
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Post by Dbvwt Tue Jul 04, 2023 10:17 am

When I did a major rewire on my 2018 Symbol 12v system, I think the main water pump and Whale were fed from the same fuse (F4).
The diagram below would seem to confirm this.

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Post by Caraman Tue Jul 04, 2023 4:17 pm

It might also be worth checking the Whale inlet pressure switch is working properly.  It’s easy enough to do this with a multimeter.  When external water pressure is applied the switch should close which allows power to open the solenoid valve.  The pressure switch adjuster at the back of the Whale inlet socket should be fully unscrewed.  It can even be removed.  You can also confirm that power is getting to the Whale inlet socket by measuring the voltage on the socket’s external brass contacts for the external Whale pump.
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Post by Kemerton-bath Tue Jul 04, 2023 8:18 pm

Jaanca wrote:Hi, I have searched but can't see a solution for this one.
The water master connects to the Whale fitting on my Symbol. The other end is connected to a tap.
After connecting the whale plug and turning the 12v electrics on there is no water going into the freshwater tank.
I have cleaned the filter in the solenoid. I ran a 12v supply from the battery directly to the solenoid and the tank started to fill.
There doesn't seem to be a separate fuse for the solenoid. Could it be the tank sensor? Does anyone know how the system works?

Thanks
I had exactly the same experience on a 2015 Kemerton and concluded it was tank sensor playing up. Having connected a 12V feed directly to the solenoid as you did, I couldn’t see what else might be the fault. On that van the tank sensor in the Whale circuit was a float switch and I managed to rectify it by rocking the van to free it (no sniggering at the back please). I think I was lucky and the fault never reappeared.

Tim

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Post by Jaanca Fri Jul 07, 2023 11:12 am

Many thanks for your suggestions. Unfortunately I haven't been able to get it working yet (loved the idea of rocking the van to some Deep Purple) 
I'm guessing it must be the tank sensor. My frustration is not being able to find out exactly how this works. 
So, if the system was working -
- whale connector in place with water on
- turn on 12v at control panel
- 12v routed to solenoid to 'open' inlet valve (where does this 12v come from, can't see it on the ECU500 wiring loom - no matching wire colour)
- sensor detects water level 'full' and turns off 12v to solenoid shutting inlet valve.
Besides the routing of the 12v to the sensor and solenoid maybe I've answered my own question!
So is the solenoid continually activated when the freshwater tank is not full even without the whale connected?
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Post by Caraman Fri Jul 07, 2023 1:00 pm

Jaanca wrote:Many thanks for your suggestions. Unfortunately I haven't been able to get it working yet (loved the idea of rocking the van to some Deep Purple) 
I'm guessing it must be the tank sensor. My frustration is not being able to find out exactly how this works. 
So, if the system was working -
- whale connector in place with water on
- turn on 12v at control panel
- 12v routed to solenoid to 'open' inlet valve (where does this 12v come from, can't see it on the ECU500 wiring loom - no matching wire colour)
- sensor detects water level 'full' and turns off 12v to solenoid shutting inlet valve.
Besides the routing of the 12v to the sensor and solenoid maybe I've answered my own question!
So is the solenoid continually activated when the freshwater tank is not full even without the whale connected?
Yes - when the tank is not full and everything is switched on the brass contacts on the outside of the Whale inlet socket should be live.  If they are and external water pressure (from the external pump or mains water connection) is applied to the pressure switch in the Whale inlet socket, is should close sending power to the solenoid valve which should then open.  If no power is getting to the brass contacts on the outside of the Whale inlet socket, the solenoid valve will stay shut.  The solenoid valve needs power from the pressure switch for it to open.  If no power is getting to the brass contacts on the outside of the Whale inlet socket and the tank is not full, the fault is either the float switch in the freshwater tank, the fuse, a bad connection or possibly a relay in the switching which I am less familiar with.
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Post by bertb Tue Jul 25, 2023 2:36 pm

I don't know if this problem has been fixed but my take on the Whale system is that the water pump switch has to be on at the same time. 
It could be that when folk say "turn on the 12v" they mean the pump switch on the control panel in which case ignore all the above!
BTW I am a 'hater' I think the Whale system is less convenient than the gravity method. Now I have to carry a water container with me every time.
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