PEUGEOT TPMS ADJUSTMENT

Some Peugeot dealers have adjusted the Boxer’s TPMS to allow lower pressures recommended by the tyre manufacturer to be used but others have stuck to the direction given below by Peugeot UK which was printed in the April 2020 MMM:
 
The TPMS comes pre-set from the factory to the standard commercial vehicle specification. Convertors can work with tyre manufacturers to determine what lower pressures the tyre can safely be run at when the conversion is complete and can have the TPMS modified to this by the Peugeot technician as part of the pre-delivery inspection. The converter would then fit a new sticker over the Peugeot label on the passenger B pillar denoting the new pressures. For safety reasons we do not amend the tyre pressure within a dealership unless the above protocol has been followed. 
 
Earlier this month I contacted Peugeot UK’s homologation engineer Ian.Cowley@mpsa.com.  Initially he stated:
 
…. as the vehicle has been converted by Auto-Sleepers, you will need to discuss your concern with them directly. We cannot permit a lower tyre pressure value, this is something that Auto-Sleepers and the tyre manufacturer must discuss. If it is permitted, written confirmation must be obtained before the values can be changed in the ECU.
 
Auto-Sleepers would not provide ‘written confirmation’ as they have not worked with Continental to determine what lower tyre pressures should be used and, as UK type approval has already been granted by the VCA and the vehicle registered, they say it is too late for the tyre pressure label to be changed.  As a result, Peugeot UK’s homologation engineer changed his statement:
 
To clarify, Automobiles Peugeot hold the European type approval for the base vehicle. The vehicle has then undergone conversion and is then type approved and registered against the Auto-Sleepers type approval.  The type approval is used for defining the vehicle at the point of registration. Anything that is done post registration has to satisfy the legislation in force in the member state ie fitting accessories such as wheels/tyres, navigation systems etc.  Automobiles Peugeot cannot authorise the different tyre pressures as the declared pressures were obtained in conjunction with the tyre manufacturer based on the base vehicle. If the tyre manufacturer, with the information and knowledge of the completed vehicle, has indicated that the vehicle is safe to run at different pressures, then written confirmation will be required from them that can then be presented to an authorised repairer who can then adjust the set values.
 
Auto-Sleepers declined to obtain the ‘written conformation’ so I approached Continental for it.  Continental UK’s General Manager of Technical Services happily provided the following statement based on detail I provided which included that my front axle mass cannot exceed 1500 kg without the rear axle and vehicle MTPLMs being exceeded:
 
The front TPMS should be set as if the plated front tyre pressure is 3.4 bar rather than 5 bar.  This correlates with an actual front axle mass of 1500 kg with a degree of uneven loading across the axle.  This should then ensure optimum handling, stability and front traction performance.
 
A local dealer has now adjusted my front TPMS so it does not trigger at 3.0 bar and above.  They charged £45 labour plus VAT = £54.  Another dealer was going to charge much more than this.
 
Peugeot UK’s homologation engineer advised that the exercise is repeated if a different brand or type of tyre is fitted and that the insurance company is informed of any change to the TPMS.

Roopert wrote:

marconi wrote:
The fault lies squarely with Auto-Sleepers

I don't entirely agree with that. If VW can implement a system that requires just one button on the dash to set the TPMS, then Peugeot could do the same, at minimal cost.

Previous posts on the subject suggest that it's an Indirect system. If so, the functions will already have been built into the ABS controller by Bosch, Valeo or whoever manufactures it. On a T5 it requires no more than one monetary action switch and one wire (I know this because I retro-fitted the factory option to mine). Everything else is already there, built into the ABS controller.

IMO there is no good reason for Peugeot to design their commercial vehicles to be so user-hostile.

The TPMS is a direct system i.e. it has sensors in each wheel that send pressure and possibly temperature signals to the TPMS receiver.  When the TPMS is triggered due to low pressure it is possible to see the pressure it was triggered at.  It is not an indirect system that works through the ABS that utilises small variations in tyre circumference caused by changes in the tyre's pressure.  

I believe that direct TPMSs that can be adjusted by the driver are available but the one fitted as an optional extra (about £200) to Peugeot Boxers, Citroen Relays and Fiat Ducatos in the factory in Italy is not one of them.  IMO it is not Peugeot/Citroen/Fiat who are at fault, it is the regulations that are at fault which should make it mandatory for all TPMSs to be adjustable by the driver so that the driver can vary the tyre pressures according to load and the tyre manufacturer's recommendations.  

In defence of Peugeot/Citroen/Fiat they will adjust the TPMS for the converter if the converter asks them to do so as part of the Stage 2 type approval and as a result fits a new tyre pressure label.  Bailey has done this and after extensive testing with the tyre manufacturer reduced the plated front tyre pressure from 5.0 bar to 50 psi and had the TPMS adjusted by Peugeot.  Auto-Sleepers like many other converters has not done this because it would appear that the regulations do not require them to.  IMO, once again it is the regulations that are at fault.  

When I discussed this with the CAMC they said the fault was with the converter and it is very widespread.  They suggested I took it up with the NCC which I did but their response was it was it is a matter between Peugeot, Auto-Sleepers and the VCA.  They did however say "all vehicles are plated with the tyre pressure for the maximum load that the vehicle can carry and it will be the drivers’ responsibility to vary this pressure if they wish to use the vehicle in an unloaded condition. Well its a bit difficult to comply with this if the the TPMS doesn't allow the pressure to be varied!

IMO this is a farcical and dangerous situation that requires urgent regulatory change.  I have expressed this view to the DoT through the DVSA and VCA and will continue to do so until change is made.  I urge others to do likewise.

Libraryman2 wrote:I lowered my tyre pressures on the front to 3.7 bar....without them going into alarm.....however after 1 cold night in France the left TPS triggered..(low pressure)
I decided to increase the pressures back up..to get rid of the pesky alarm...that went well....not.

I pulled into two garages but the air lines only catered for cars...that left me worse off....with both TPS triggering now!!

Anyway..eventually found a good air line and put them back up to 5.5 bar...the TPS alarm reset immediately..no need to run around...

So now I’ve lowered them to 4 bar....hopefully they will stay there...the front axle weight is 1620 kgs

Im not sure if that front axle weight means I’m wrongly setting front tyres lower than the 5.5 bar but it is more comfortable...the rear are at 5.5 bar 80psi...

Michelin agilis 16 inch 

Ray

Ray,
I believe your Corinium has bigger CP tyres than the Nuevo/Broadway, a higher rated front axle (2100 kg instead of 1850 kg) with a front plated tyre pressure of 5.5 bar rather than 5.0 bar.  On my Nuevo before having the TPMS adjusted I could get the front tyre pressures down from 5.0 bar to about 4.3 bar without triggering but much below that it triggered.  It was necessary to re-inflate to the plated pressure and run the tyre for a short distance to reset the TPMS after it was triggered.  For a while I did run with a permanently triggered TPMS on both front tyres but this meant I no longer had an effective TPMS.  Although it showed the offending low pressures every time I turned on the ignition, these were the hot pressures recorded when the vehicle was last run so of absolutely no use.  I guess this is the same for all TPMSs that show the pressure as the sensors will only activate when the wheels are turning and maybe then not immediately.

Excellent work, especially by Caraman and Marconi, to whom we are all much indebted.

I have this morning reported the defect using the form. I suggested that, pending a change in the regulations to plug the lacuna, temporary non-statutory guidance be issued to Stage 2 converters.

Cymro

marconi wrote:
Personally I would much prefer a big hammer.

Sure - but it'll take the authorities a long time to lift it! 
Meanwhile, surely they can nudge the slowcoaches to catch up Bailey etc.

Fingers crossed!

Cymro

Peugeot UK’s homologation engineer advised that the exercise is repeated if a different brand or type of tyre is fitted and that the insurance company is informed of any change to the TPMS.

My insurance company had no issue over the change to my TPMS and nor should they as it made the motorhome safer and therefore reduced their exposure to risk.