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EM 40 and Trailer Board

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Post by Firedecisions on Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:40 am

I have just been able to start looking at my new Broadway EB picked up just before lockdown and been in secure storage ever since.  We will want to carry bikes so need to deal with the number plate and rear lights issue with a trailer board.  The manual talks about the Sargent EM 40 as having a “connector for a tow bar”
Looking on line I can not find any form of wiring diagram or instructions for the EM 40.  Has any Broadway or other users used this to connect into? And does the tow bar harness available from the Auto Sleeper parts list fit into the EM 40 as it says it’s for the VLM?

Thanks 
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Post by Mids on Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:10 am

Hi I have a 2019 Broadway eb  dont know what the em40 is. But have just had the wiring done for a trailer board .guy  fits tow bars .but has made us a bespoke  frame to fit a trailer board to so we can use the bike cover as well.
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Post by marconi on Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:45 am

Firedecisions wrote:I have just been able to start looking at my new Broadway EB picked up just before lockdown and been in secure storage ever since.  We will want to carry bikes so need to deal with the number plate and rear lights issue with a trailer board.  The manual talks about the Sargent EM 40 as having a “connector for a tow bar”
Looking on line I can not find any form of wiring diagram or instructions for the EM 40.  Has any Broadway or other users used this to connect into? And does the tow bar harness available from the Auto Sleeper parts list fit into the EM 40 as it says it’s for the VLM?

Thanks 
Adrian
This thread has all the information you need.


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Post by Relaxez-Vous on Sat Jul 04, 2020 10:35 am

Just interested here, our van also has a EM40 fuse box unit with fuses labelled "Towing" and "Towing D+". Is the VLM5 a separate box into which the lighting for the trailer board would be plugged, does this plug into the EM40 or the Sargent EC700 PSU?

At the back of our EM40 when I last looked there was a Molex shaped socket mounted on the PCB but it only had a few connections.
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Post by Mids on Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:11 am

Sorry as said we don't  seem to have em40 on our Broadway not even mentioned  in handbook. Only ec700
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Post by marconi on Sat Jul 04, 2020 12:47 pm

Relaxez-Vous wrote:Just interested here, our van also has a EM40 fuse box unit with fuses labelled "Towing" and "Towing D+". Is the VLM5 a separate box into which the lighting for the trailer board would be plugged, does this plug into the EM40 or the Sargent EC700 PSU?

At the back of our EM40 when I last looked there was a Molex shaped socket mounted on the PCB but it only had a few connections.

The EM40 provides the fusing of Vehicle battery Power for a typical Caravan set up with the D+ there is a 3 pin Towing socket, the VLM5 covers the vehicle lighting, the inputs to it will be from the Vehicle wiring plus the Can bus. Not sure about any other connections to it off the top of my head.
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Post by Firedecisions on Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:29 pm

Thanks, looked at the link and that’s for the VLM 5, I don’t have one just the EM40 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

7.29 last bullet point of the list states the EM40 has the connections
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Post by IanH on Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:35 pm

Allergic to anything Sargent, I'd have a trailer specialist do it.
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Post by marconi on Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:49 pm

Firedecisions wrote:Thanks, looked at the link and that’s for the VLM 5, I don’t have one just the EM40 [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

7.29 last bullet point of the list states the EM40 has the connections

I would be surprised if you don't have a VLM 5, unless the Merc chassis is done a different way to the Peugeot or the Broadway has a very special EM40.

I don't know the Broadway, I was pretty sure that someone has done a self fit Trailer Board on a 2019 model following the details in the link, I cant find a reference sorry.

Yes the EM40 as the advert says has a connector for connection to a tow bar, it is 3 pin, Vehicle Battery Positive and Negative and D+.  You don't have a Fridge on your Bike Rack.

Edit
On checking Sargent site there is a VLM5 for the Mercedes Chassis.

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Post by rgermain on Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:12 pm

IanH wrote:Allergic to anything Sargent, I'd have a trailer specialist do it.
Yes I agree, when I had my socket fitted for our lighting board, I went to a trailer/towbar specialist near us and they fitted it in under 1 hr, men all over the van, must had hit a quite time. 

They ran cable from fuse box under dash, cable in flex conduit under the van, they picked up the canbus, what ever that is, buzzer included. No joining into wiring loom for lights etc.

Cost £130 all in inc. extra number plate. smile!
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Post by Caraman on Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:04 pm

The confusion is understandable as the VLM5 unit doesn't get a mention in any of the documentation provided with the Nuevo/Broadway but it definitely exists and connecting a lighting board to it is a doddle that only costs a few pounds.
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Post by Mids on Sun Jul 05, 2020 5:37 am

After having a look  around did find the em40. But wiring fir trailer board was done like rgermain said
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Post by Caraman on Sun Jul 05, 2020 7:16 am

Mids wrote:After having a look  around did find the em40. But wiring fir trailer board was done like rgermain said
If its done and it works then fine but the wiring for a lighting board or tow bar electrics (they are the same thing) is designed to plug into the VLM5 unit at the back of the motorhome and it is an easy DIY job.  If you go to a tow bar fitter and quite possibly the motorhome dealer they might not know about the VLM5 unit.  I found out about it from Auto-Sleepers directly and then from Sargent who provided the wiring instructions.  Sargent will also provide a cable to go between the VLM5 unit and a 13 pin trailer socket but its very expensive and is designed to provide the full electrics for a caravan which aren't needed for a lighting board.
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Post by marconi on Sun Jul 05, 2020 9:38 am

marconi wrote:

I would be surprised if you don't have a VLM 5, unless the Merc chassis is done a different way to the Peugeot

Thanks for the info Mids. I wonder is your Lighting Board LED or Standard bulbs.

For completeness and to be helpful for others maybe another 2019, Broadway owner could confirm that there is no VLM5 required with the Mercedes chassis and a Lighting board is wired direct.

Nice of AS to give absolutely no information as usual in the manual. 2019 Nuevo, what manual, we didn't get one.
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Post by Liam on Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:28 am

marconi wrote:
marconi wrote:

I would be surprised if you don't have a VLM 5, unless the Merc chassis is done a different way to the Peugeot

Thanks for the info Mids. I wonder is your Lighting Board LED or Standard bulbs.

For completeness and to be helpful for others maybe another 2019, Broadway owner could confirm that there is no VLM5 required with the Mercedes chassis and a Lighting board is wired direct.

Nice of AS to give absolutely no information as usual in the manual. 2019 Nuevo, what manual, we didn't get one.
Speaking to a dealer last week I was told that all of the current coach built vans have this connection installed as standard. Apparently, it has been included as part of the factory build since AS introduced the rear bicycle rack reinforcing bars and the subsequent realisation that the vehicle was potentially not road legal because of obscuration of the rear lights and number plate when carrying bikes. 
The bars have been deliberately set low because of a request by the owners club and difficulty experienced in lifting bikes onto higher mounted racks!
So dealers are aware if you ask!

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Post by Mids on Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:46 am

Hi the lighting board has led lights and a reverse light
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Post by marconi on Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:01 pm

Thanks Liam.

Where are all the other Broadway owners, do they have a VLM5 hidden somewhere.

Apologies for adding a bit of confusion by assigning the possibility of a Mercedes Chassis on current Broadways. Do the other B's on Mercedes have a VLM5.

Thanks Mids. That could explain it, connecting an LED set up may well not confuse the ECU. However we are told by Sargent that connecting an LED set up to the VLM5 may upset the bulb fail detection.

Do we have a silly situation here. There was no need for the VLM5 in the first place. It just makes it easier to connect a Lighting Board and for Sargent to sell a very expensive cable.
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Post by Caraman on Sun Jul 05, 2020 1:59 pm

Liam wrote:

So dealers are aware if you ask!
They might be aware now but mine certainly wasn't in Apr/May last year.  They told me I didn't need a lighting board!  The 2018 AS Owner's Manual states "Your vehicle it fitted with the mounting points for a Fiamma bike rack as standard.  For further details, please consult your dealer or Service Department." It should also say that a lighting board is required.  Once I realised this, the dealer had no idea how a lighting board should be connected.  I had to work it out for myself with the help of AS, Sargent and the Forum.


Last edited by Caraman on Sun Jul 05, 2020 2:00 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : typo)
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Post by Liam on Sun Jul 05, 2020 4:59 pm

Caraman wrote:
Liam wrote:

So dealers are aware if you ask!
They might be aware now but mine certainly wasn't in Apr/May last year.  They told me I didn't need a lighting board!  The 2018 AS Owner's Manual states "Your vehicle it fitted with the mounting points for a Fiamma bike rack as standard.  For further details, please consult your dealer or Service Department." It should also say that a lighting board is required.  Once I realised this, the dealer had no idea how a lighting board should be connected.  I had to work it out for myself with the help of AS, Sargent and the Forum.
All AS dealers would have been briefed by AS HQ on the technicalities associated with that mounting when it was first introduced.
 
So they should be aware - depends who in the dealership read the technical brief! 

I suspect that it is not in the manual because AS assumed, incorrectly perhaps, that it would be a dealer fit item and not the customer fitting it independently.

From my experience of dealers, a lot depends on the dealership and the sales staff, some are genuinely interested in and are fully aware of the product and all of its techie bits, whilst others are just intent on selling a van, any van - particularly if they are also agents for other manufacturers.

The real problem is that once they have sold you a vehicle their interest in you wanes and the best source of information I have found to be either the service department at the dealers or better still the one at AS Willersey - particularly Mark Burdett when he was the manager there.

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Post by marconi on Sun Jul 05, 2020 9:34 pm

Hmm, Quote vanished.

Caraman.

Same here my dealer sold the Nuevo with the cycle rack included but had to fit it after delivery, not a word about a lighting board.

I subsequently contacted Willersey and received a rather abusive reply saying it was not their worry, it was up to me to decide whether it was legal or not.
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Post by Firedecisions on Mon Jul 06, 2020 11:15 am

Thanks for the replies, now away in the New Forest, found the EM40 under the seat by battery and the EC 700 in the cupboard next to the fridge, no sign of the VLM yet! It’s a Broadway End Bathroom on a Peugeot
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Post by Caraman on Mon Jul 06, 2020 11:28 am

Firedecisions wrote:Thanks for the replies, now away in the New Forest, found the EM40 under the seat by battery and the EC 700 in the cupboard next to the fridge, no sign of the VLM yet! It’s a Broadway End Bathroom on a Peugeot
If you switch on your hazard warning lights, you will get a clicking noise from the front and a clicking noise from the back which is coming from the VLM5 unit.  That should help you find it.
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Post by Firedecisions on Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:42 pm

Thanks Caraman, that worked found it behind the bottom draw in the end wardrobe.

Checking underneath noted that the plywood of the rear panel is blown so will get them to look at that as well!
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Post by kaspian on Mon Jul 06, 2020 1:53 pm

Firedecisions wrote:Thanks Caraman, that worked found it behind the bottom draw in the end wardrobe.

Checking underneath noted that the plywood of the rear panel is blown so will get them to look at that as well!
Hi F/d  is this blown plywood on a 2020 van ??  Gulp!
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Post by Caraman on Mon Jul 06, 2020 2:18 pm

Firedecisions wrote:Thanks Caraman, that worked found it behind the bottom draw in the end wardrobe.

Checking underneath noted that the plywood of the rear panel is blown so will get them to look at that as well!
That’s good news but not about the blown plywood on a brand new van!
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