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Mercedes Servicing

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Post by CC Tue Dec 19, 2023 5:51 pm

Hope you’ve had a better experience than I had at Mercedes Benz, Barker Street, Norwich (Group1Automotive) yesterday, purchased a brand new car from them and it went in for its first service yesterday, absolutely abysmal experience, have a 3yr service plan but doubt I’ll be returning to them again, what an absolute shower! Have put my complaint and their failings in writing, told them I’ve had better service and felt more valued by the likes of ATS and KwikFit than I did with them, would never buy another Mercedes.

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Post by PLOUGHLIN Wed Dec 20, 2023 11:27 am

CC wrote:Hope you’ve had a better experience than I had at Mercedes Benz, Barker Street, Norwich (Group1Automotive) yesterday, purchased a brand new car from them and it went in for its first service yesterday, absolutely abysmal experience, have a 3yr service plan but doubt I’ll be returning to them again, what an absolute shower! Have put my complaint and their failings in writing, told them I’ve had better service and felt more valued by the likes of ATS and KwikFit than I did with them, would never buy another Mercedes.

I use Group1Automative in Cambridge for my E Class service, now 11 years old, and have always had good efficient service, lent me a £80k electric last time. Try one of their other branches, Kings Lynn or Bury St Edmunds, though your service plan allows use of any MB dealer.

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Post by mikethebike Wed Dec 20, 2023 3:54 pm

CC wrote:Hope you’ve had a better experience than I had at Mercedes Benz, Barker Street, Norwich (Group1Automotive) yesterday, purchased a brand new car from them and it went in for its first service yesterday, absolutely abysmal experience, have a 3yr service plan but doubt I’ll be returning to them again, what an absolute shower! Have put my complaint and their failings in writing, told them I’ve had better service and felt more valued by the likes of ATS and KwikFit than I did with them, would never buy another Mercedes.
Bought my current MB from Norwich. hugegrins
Not needed a service yet but I use Peterborough  Mercedes(group 1 auto).Do their best to fix my cars but my problems have been EML and sat Nav rubbish  with this one.!!
Warranty is the best I have had since retiring.
I will speak to my service manager ,Dave,about your bad experience.
Maybe get him to  arrange collecting your car for your next service.
regards

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Post by gassygassy Wed Dec 20, 2023 8:24 pm

Further to my last post about how happy I was with this commercial MB dealer in France, I sent one of the broken bits to my electronics friend. He recognised it as a stepper motor and looked it up on the internet. This part which the dealer charged me €85 for, costs £9 from china, same part number moulded into it. Still, that is exactly what you expect. Imagine if it cost £85 from China, it would be £800 from a MB dealer here.
I will be looking for a commercial garage nearer than the one which told me their labour rate is £180 per hour. At that rate it will be cheaper to return to the one in France for servicing. Including the ferry fee. They did have some sample servicing and brakes prices listed in a leaflet and I thought they were very reasonable. Specially considering I have up to now done all my own servicing on the hundreds of cars that have passed through my hands.

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Post by groundhog Thu Dec 21, 2023 9:57 am

I have had brilliant Mercedes serving from MB Exeter and the one in Crawley (forget the name) but really disappointed with MB commercial side at Probus near Truro, I guess it depends on your branch as to how the service is. In the same MB dealer in Truro they have a car department, always been good, commercial not so, even in the same branch it can vary.
My van is now 12 years old so I will be looking for an independent service centre in future, both our cars (Merc and BMW) are looked after by a local sports and classic car company who are passionate about what they do unlike most main agents who just follow the manual. Sadly the van will not fit on their ramp!
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Post by gassygassy Thu Dec 21, 2023 5:32 pm

Where are you Groundhog - I have a 1983 Mercedes and wonder where if anywhere I should take it for work. Part of the reason for buying it was that it has no electronics whatsoever - except for starter motor, lights, heater blower and windscreen wiper. So the theory is I should be able to work on it myself but I would like to know where to take it for stuff I don't know .
Actually I think it is pre-1981 because of the VIN. But it was first registered here as 1983 and I suspect I'll have to wait till January or even April to get it registered as historic.
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Post by groundhog Thu Dec 21, 2023 5:46 pm

Lovely looking car! I use Perranwell Garage in Cornwall, you can Google it easy enough
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Post by grahamsb Wed Dec 27, 2023 12:04 pm

I have just had the first service carried out on my Bourton.

I was quoted £398.40 for the A Service. (sounds better than £400!!)

When I arrived at the Merc workshop, I was told that looking on the system, I also needed to have the automatic gearbox oil replaced at a cost of just under £500 !!!!

"WHAT", I said. "Well you don't HAVE to have it replaced, but if you don't and then have any problems with the gearbox, it won't be covered by the warranty". Sounded like blackmail to me, but there was no way I was going to risk a VERY expensive gearbox repair in the future.

They also checked to see if they could offer me a service plan, but there was not one available.

Was I conned?? Have others been told the gearbox oil needs to be changed at the first service? 

When I owned Mercedes cars, I always had them serviced at the Merc dealership. I have to say that I only ever paid for the (expensive) service costs and everything else was covered. It was (and is) also reassuring to know you are covered for any breakdowns. Not that I have ever had one in a Mercedes car.
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Post by Paulmold Wed Dec 27, 2023 12:23 pm

According to MB dealer Belltruckandvan, a service plan is available for all vans regardless of age.

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Post by grahamsb Wed Dec 27, 2023 12:36 pm

Paulmold wrote:According to MB dealer Belltruckandvan, a service plan is available for all vans regardless of age.
Is it excluded because it's a motorhome?
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Post by Paulmold Wed Dec 27, 2023 12:40 pm

grahamsb wrote:
Is it excluded because it's a motorhome?
No idea but here's their Web page....

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Post by PLOUGHLIN Wed Dec 27, 2023 12:54 pm

According to my MB Sprinter Service book, Auto Box oil and filter change is included in 1st Maintenance service (B) not the oil service (A) ie at 2 years old, then every 120K km. Your later chassis may be different.

Check the Maintenance booklet under "Additional Work".

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Post by mikethebike Wed Dec 27, 2023 3:41 pm

grahamsb wrote:I have just had the first service carried out on my Bourton.

I was quoted £398.40 for the A Service. (sounds better than £400!!)

When I arrived at the Merc workshop, I was told that looking on the system, I also needed to have the automatic gearbox oil replaced at a cost of just under £500 !!!!

"WHAT", I said. "Well you don't HAVE to have it replaced, but if you don't and then have any problems with the gearbox, it won't be covered by the warranty". Sounded like blackmail to me, but there was no way I was going to risk a VERY expensive gearbox repair in the future.

They also checked to see if they could offer me a service plan, but there was not one available.

Was I conned?? Have others been told the gearbox oil needs to be changed at the first service? 

When I owned Mercedes cars, I always had them serviced at the Merc dealership. I have to say that I only ever paid for the (expensive) service costs and everything else was covered. It was (and is) also reassuring to know you are covered for any breakdowns. Not that I have ever had one in a Mercedes car.
Just checked my MB device docs. That service was done at 5 years!!!
Never had a MB that long before.!!
Another question to ask the dealer!
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Post by grahamsb Wed Dec 27, 2023 4:24 pm

PLOUGHLIN wrote:According to my MB Sprinter Service book, Auto Box oil and filter change is included in 1st Maintenance service (B) not the oil service (A) ie at 2 years old, then every 120K km. Your later chassis may be different.

Check the Maintenance booklet under "Additional Work".
I have again checked through all the books supplied with the vehicle and no longer do they provide any detailed information on service requirements or intervals. Of course it is all computerised now, with the vehicle telling you when to have a service A or B. Interestingly my service was displayed as OVERDUE by 200 days, then 195 days, down to service now due!
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Post by PLOUGHLIN Wed Dec 27, 2023 6:47 pm

grahamsb wrote:
I have again checked through all the books supplied with the vehicle and no longer do they provide any detailed information on service requirements or intervals. Of course it is all computerised now, with the vehicle telling you when to have a service A or B. Interestingly my service was displayed as OVERDUE by 200 days, then 195 days, down to service now due!

It may be that the ASSYST system was working from date when delivered to AS, so "service now due was the second "Maintenance Service ", not your first service A. The earlier date overdue referring to the first oil service A?

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Post by grahamsb Thu Dec 28, 2023 9:00 am

Thank you Peter.

No, it did start by giving the correct number of days until the service was due, but then changed to "Overdue". Going into the system confirmed the message on the dash was incorrect. 

With everything controlled by computers, you can no longer check oil levels with a dipstick and if your AdBlue sensor incorrectly indicates it is empty the vehicle stops!!! scratch head
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Post by gassygassy Thu Dec 28, 2023 6:19 pm

One of the reasons I bought a Sprinter based MH is that it has a regular torque converter gearbox. I have changed the ATF on many a Merc car, and it really is a DIY job, although there are a few differences between that and changing the engine oil.
The most significant one, which you wouldn't necessarily know about is that the ATF flows around the gearbox and the torque converter. At the bottom of the torque converter bell housing there is a hole, and if you shine a torch up there and rotate the engine you will eventually find a small (it may be 10mm I don't know precisely) bolt on the outside diameter of the torque converter. Unscrew this and the torque converter oil drains. You also drain the gearbox oil as well of course. Then you undo all the bolts around the gearbox sump plate and remove it. Then you will see what looks like a fairly flat stainless steel plate, about 10 inches by 6 inches, which is the oil filter. You need to get a replacement one from MB of course, and it will (or at least should) come with a new rubber gasket. Undo the (I think) three bolts holding the stainless steel flat filter (it's a fairly thin, flat steel box with holes in it, quite unlike an engine oil filter) and remove the filter. The oil will be red, and fairly runny. Fit a new filter , refit the gearbox sump with the new gasket and all its bolts, make sure you replace the 10mm bolt at the bottom of the torque converter and refill the gearbox from the engine filler tube with the correct volume of ATF.
Yes, it is a job that is worth doing. I can't find the actual price of the oil and filter but the experts in the motorhome press say you should always use genuine parts. I wouldn't be surprised if the parts - gasket, filter and oil - cost £100 or thereabouts.
In Summmary: If you are competent to change your car engine oil, you can change the auto gearbox oil. If not, don't.
When mine needs doing I will ask my friendly neighbourhood garage what they would charge, using genuine MB parts and genuine MB filter. They would have to reset the service computer as well of course.
Otherwise I would add that it would take an MB technician probably an hour's work, plus whatever the parts cost. I asked my 'local' commercial MB dealer what their labour charge is, and it is £180 / hour. At that rate I feel very inclined to go back to the place in France that I had my heater repair done. It might be cheaper to pay the diesel and ferry than use my local MB dealer. The French dealer had some very reasonable prices for servicing and things like brake discs and pads. I would say you don't have to do it all that often, you could stretch the time between changes because you don't do 50,000 miles a year as an Amazon van would.

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Post by WANDERING DAVE Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:33 pm

grahamsb wrote:I have just had the first service carried out on my Bourton.

I was quoted £398.40 for the A Service. (sounds better than £400!!)

When I arrived at the Merc workshop, I was told that looking on the system, I also needed to have the automatic gearbox oil replaced at a cost of just under £500 !!!!

"WHAT", I said. "Well you don't HAVE to have it replaced, but if you don't and then have any problems with the gearbox, it won't be covered by the warranty". Sounded like blackmail to me, but there was no way I was going to risk a VERY expensive gearbox repair in the future.

They also checked to see if they could offer me a service plan, but there was not one available.

Was I conned?? Have others been told the gearbox oil needs to be changed at the first service? 

When I owned Mercedes cars, I always had them serviced at the Merc dealership. I have to say that I only ever paid for the (expensive) service costs and everything else was covered. It was (and is) also reassuring to know you are covered for any breakdowns. Not that I have ever had one in a Mercedes car.
Like you I have just had my first service on my Bourton,
 It was booked in as a sit and wait service at Ipswich, I asked How long it would be and was told about an hour.
 Three hours later I asked how much longer would it would it be. one hour later they said it was ready, 
 Like you I was charged £400 and was then told they did not have time to check the gearbox oil.
I asked what had they done, they said changed the engine oil and filter, would I like to book it in for the gearbox oil to be checked I asked how much was that and Like you was told £500.
I said its only done 200 miles, they said its only a recommendation,  and was told exactly the same as you.
Make your own mind up if its a con or not  This was a M D Main Agent.
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Post by grahamsb Sat Jan 06, 2024 9:32 am

The "Con" if it is one, is therefore common to both Suffolk and Dorset, so presumably it is standard Merc practice.

In my case, having covered 9000 miles, it was reassuring to know any initial metallic particles had been removed from the hard working gearbox. (At least that's how I try to justify the cost!). Also, with so much money invested in the van, the servicing costs are a very small proportion. If it were 10+ years old, I would think differently and use a local non-franchise garage.

Like  Wandering Dave, I booked a "While you wait" service. Mine also took 4 hours, but that included the gear box oil.
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Post by gassygassy Sat Jan 06, 2024 11:28 am

WANDERING DAVE wrote:...........
 Like you I was charged £400 and was then told they did not have time to check the gearbox oil.
............
Ah yes, it takes a considerable time to check the gearbox oil. The technician has to open the bonnet (which is already open for the service), move his head forwards to the point where he can see the gearbox oil dip stick, reach his hand forward, lift the dip stick out, move his eyes towards the notches at the bottom of the dip stick, wait for the light waves travelling at 286,000 miles per second to reach his retina, plus the time taken for the signals to travel from his retina to his brain, plus the time for his brain to decide if the oil level is correct, plus the time taken to relocate the dip stick back into its tube and push it down, and after all that tremendous exertion he has to lift the bonnet half an inch, lift out the bonnet stay and replace it in its holder, and lower the bonnet. Well that obviously takes an hour so they didn't have time in between lunch and tea breaks to do that. You're lucky they didn't, that would have been a £180 job - obviously it would take an hour.

I've discovered why they didn't have time. I just looked under my bonnet, and there is no dip stick that I can see. Clearly someone in MB has decided it is more rewarding to charge £500 to change gearbox oil than it is to provide a dip stick. Instead of a dip stick no doubt there is a lot of flaky computerisation with a level sensor, possibly an oil condition sensor, and a computer to translate the sensor into meaningful information that can be read out on the OBD system.
The older engines and gearboxes of course would have had dip sticks.

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Post by grahamsb Sat Jan 06, 2024 11:49 am

As I said in my earlier post (Dec 28th), everything is now controlled by computers. If a modern vehicle stops, you lift the bonnet, scratch your head and call out the man (or woman) to connect their computer!

I did ask why changing the gear oil was so expensive and time-consuming. As gassygassy guessed, it's all computerised. Then after filling with new gear oil, they have to run the engine to bring it up to temperature. Only then will computer tell them if the gear oil level is correct. So, they don't know the exact capacity to fill with a measured amount of oil????? It's called progress. confused3
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Post by gassygassy Sat Jan 06, 2024 11:51 am

I've just looked at the invoice I got when I had my heater fixed in France.
My theory sounds as if it is correct: that it will be cheaper to pay a ferry fee to go to France and have servicing done than it is to have it here. The hourly labour rate I was charged was 100 Euros, say £86 in today's money. Plus VAT of course, which makes it £103.20 per hour as opposed to what I was told by my local MB dealer which was £140/hr plus VAT, i.e. £168 /hr.
I am now going to send them an email and ask the cost for the A and B services, and shortly after that I will be booking a ferry. smile!
 I've just tried to scan the invoice and post it here, but apparently a pdf file type is not allowed. Strange? What sort of file type is allowed then?

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Post by gassygassy Sat Jan 06, 2024 12:09 pm

It would seem, looking at the invoice that they have several different hourly rates for labour. The most expensive was €110 / hour, of which they took 0.2hrs to test the system, and the cheapest rate was €78.72 / hour for " Moteur pas a pas" which sounds as if it means step by step testing of the motor.
My wagon has done, or will have done 15,000 miles by this summer so if their price for changing the gearbox oil is reasonable I'll have it done there. I have now done a jpg scan so hopefully here it is:
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I now notice that they charged for 3 hours of engine testing which seems a bit excessive - although at €78.72 / hr. We were there for 6 hours including their compulsory 2 hour lunch break. Anyway if you consider that I was shivering while driving because the heater didn't work, all in all the price of £570 was acceptable for a decrepit 73 1/2 year old who couldn't have done the job anyway.
Also of course don't forget the £570 included about £50 worth of coffee and biscuits (at Costa prices) that we consumed whilst in the waiting reception area.

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Post by gassygassy Sat Jan 06, 2024 12:39 pm

grahamsb wrote:As I said in my earlier post (Dec 28th), everything is now controlled by computers. If a modern vehicle stops, you lift the bonnet, scratch your head and call out the man (or woman) to connect their computer!

I did ask why changing the gear oil was so expensive and time-consuming. As gassygassy guessed, it's all computerised. Then after filling with new gear oil, they have to run the engine to bring it up to temperature. Only then will computer tell them if the gear oil level is correct. So, they don't know the exact capacity to fill with a measured amount of oil????? It's called progress. confused3
According to my invoice if Google Translate has got it right, they took 3 hours to check that the heater repair they did was functioning correctly. At least it only cost £67 an hour, £100 an hour less than in the UK.

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