Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
+4
Tinwheeler
steamdrivenandy
burlingtonboaby
morristraveller
8 posters
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Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
Hi Folks
I have a 2018 Symbol Plus with only 1k miles on the clock due to lockdown. I noticed the Sun icon on the Ec700 display had gone and decided to investigate without a circuit diagram, a case of poke and hope. I noticed first that there was no led indications illuminated on the 150 watt Sargent controller and only 11volts being presented to the input. My question to yourselves is " is there any fuse or loom connecters between the solar panel and the input to the controller?". Or could it just be a duff solar panel which will require changing under warranty.
Thank you in anticipation.![up!](/users/3014/30/14/83/smiles/3459062273.gif)
I have a 2018 Symbol Plus with only 1k miles on the clock due to lockdown. I noticed the Sun icon on the Ec700 display had gone and decided to investigate without a circuit diagram, a case of poke and hope. I noticed first that there was no led indications illuminated on the 150 watt Sargent controller and only 11volts being presented to the input. My question to yourselves is " is there any fuse or loom connecters between the solar panel and the input to the controller?". Or could it just be a duff solar panel which will require changing under warranty.
Thank you in anticipation.
![up!](/users/3014/30/14/83/smiles/3459062273.gif)
morristraveller- Member
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Posts : 24
Joined : 2020-08-22
Location : West Wales
Auto-Sleeper Model : Symbol+
Vehicle Year : 2019
Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
Hi
Welcome to the forum from Bridington
Boaby
Welcome to the forum from Bridington
Boaby
burlingtonboaby- Donator
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Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
Thank You Boaby, from here in sunny Tenby. An Artic Walrus called Wally is causing chaos in the harbour today sinking rowing boats and enthralling the tourists
morristraveller- Member
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Posts : 24
Joined : 2020-08-22
Location : West Wales
Auto-Sleeper Model : Symbol+
Vehicle Year : 2019
Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
Welcome.
Can't help with your solar panel query I'm afraid. I notice that have posted this in the Coachbuilt Motorhome section when your Symbol Plus is a Van Conversion which have their own section. You've also posted the same query in Technical Chat and duplicated posts are considered to be poor forum etiquette.
Can't help with your solar panel query I'm afraid. I notice that have posted this in the Coachbuilt Motorhome section when your Symbol Plus is a Van Conversion which have their own section. You've also posted the same query in Technical Chat and duplicated posts are considered to be poor forum etiquette.
steamdrivenandy- Member
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Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
Thank you for the welcome
morristraveller- Member
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Posts : 24
Joined : 2020-08-22
Location : West Wales
Auto-Sleeper Model : Symbol+
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Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
hello M&J i reckon?morristraveller wrote:Thank you for the welcome
cant help much with the solar issue but there are a few who have this Sargent system and will be along shortly, no doubt
Guest- Guest
Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
Yes, welcome. I'm sure someone will know the way to go.
Tinwheeler- Donator
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Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
this is a duplicate thread
https://www.autosleeper-ownersforum.com/t35354-symbol-plus-no-solar-output
https://www.autosleeper-ownersforum.com/t35354-symbol-plus-no-solar-output
AutoSleepy_Don- Member
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Auto-Sleeper Model : Warwick Duo
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Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
Access to the EC700 wiring Loom varies in difficulty depending on the model. I don't know what Solar Controller you have and what has been done re connecting it.
Usually the Solar Controller input has a fly lead on it with a plug and socket connector. Often it is mounted near the EC700 under a Bench Seat if you can get access to get a look and spot the Solar Controller you should be able to unplug the Solar Panel and measure the voltage/check the connection, normally there is no fuse.
Usually the Solar Controller input has a fly lead on it with a plug and socket connector. Often it is mounted near the EC700 under a Bench Seat if you can get access to get a look and spot the Solar Controller you should be able to unplug the Solar Panel and measure the voltage/check the connection, normally there is no fuse.
marconi- Member
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Posts : 937
Joined : 2019-03-17
Location : Northamptonshire
Auto-Sleeper Model : Nuevo EK
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Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
Thank you Marconi. This is exactly how I approached the fault. The controller is a 150w Sargent item with two LED indicators, both of which are inactive. I took my voltage readings from the fly lead attached to the solar panel. My thought process was the possibility of a loom connector fault/dry joint between the fly lead and solar panel.
It would seem the dealer will have to repair / replace the panel under warranty.
I speak from the Naughty Step as I have broken the forum's etiquette, such a bad boy.
Thank you again![up!](/users/3014/30/14/83/smiles/3459062273.gif)
It would seem the dealer will have to repair / replace the panel under warranty.
I speak from the Naughty Step as I have broken the forum's etiquette, such a bad boy.
Thank you again
![up!](/users/3014/30/14/83/smiles/3459062273.gif)
morristraveller- Member
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Posts : 24
Joined : 2020-08-22
Location : West Wales
Auto-Sleeper Model : Symbol+
Vehicle Year : 2019
Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
Oh good, well not so good but at least you know.morristraveller wrote:Thank you Marconi. This is exactly how I approached the fault. The controller is a 150w Sargent item with two LED indicators, both of which are inactive. I took my voltage readings from the fly lead attached to the solar panel. My thought process was the possibility of a loom connector fault/dry joint between the fly lead and solar panel.
It would seem the dealer will have to repair / replace the panel under warranty.
I speak from the Naughty Step as I have broken the forum's etiquette, such a bad boy.
Thank you again
Does the controller look like this.
![Symbol Plus -No Solar Output Sgt_so10](https://i.servimg.com/u/f92/20/09/45/91/sgt_so10.jpg)
If so I can't believe A-S are still fitting them.
Naughty step. Your last was your 6th post, plenty of time to reach perfection. Beware the punishment's for further misdemeanors are extremely severe.
![hugegrins](/users/3014/30/14/83/smiles/1819939118.gif)
![hugegrins](/users/3014/30/14/83/smiles/1819939118.gif)
marconi- Member
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Posts : 937
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Location : Northamptonshire
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Vehicle Year : 2019
Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
Oh yes that's the regulator, it looks and feels like a marjarine box . If the panel can be changed on warranty I would try and pay a little extra and get a more powerful panel plus a better regulator.
Thanks
Thanks
morristraveller- Member
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Posts : 24
Joined : 2020-08-22
Location : West Wales
Auto-Sleeper Model : Symbol+
Vehicle Year : 2019
Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
I see from your original post you had already seen the Solar Regulator, I didn't clock that, doh! I also thought it was a 2020 van I must have read another thread and confused them.
If you can get a bigger Solar Panel it would be good. Whilst a better regulator would definitely improve things the EC700 is a hot topic on here. It is very wasteful of Solar Power and the 'Smart' charging is less than efficient.
Owners have gone for bypassing the EC700 and using a Dual Output Solar Controller. When I investigated the inefficiency problem I concluded that any expense on a Solar Controller which is connected to the EC700 is a waste of money. Others have been overjoyed with the results of ignoring the EC700.
There are numerous threads on the subject.
https://www.autosleeper-ownersforum.com/t32226-ec700
If you can get a bigger Solar Panel it would be good. Whilst a better regulator would definitely improve things the EC700 is a hot topic on here. It is very wasteful of Solar Power and the 'Smart' charging is less than efficient.
Owners have gone for bypassing the EC700 and using a Dual Output Solar Controller. When I investigated the inefficiency problem I concluded that any expense on a Solar Controller which is connected to the EC700 is a waste of money. Others have been overjoyed with the results of ignoring the EC700.
There are numerous threads on the subject.
https://www.autosleeper-ownersforum.com/t32226-ec700
marconi- Member
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Posts : 937
Joined : 2019-03-17
Location : Northamptonshire
Auto-Sleeper Model : Nuevo EK
Vehicle Year : 2019
Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
My Poking & Hoping is bearing fruit. On a not so sunny day my 80w solar panel is now banging out 18v+. With the solar panel connected to the Sargent (margarine box) regulator but disconnected from the ec700 I receive no LED activity and no output.
Should I now deduce that the regulator is knackered, or that the output must be connected to the EC700 for the clever electronics in both units to shake hands with each other and as soon as the leisure batteries drop to a low level the whole system will become active. (A simple thought from a simple man)
Thanks
Should I now deduce that the regulator is knackered, or that the output must be connected to the EC700 for the clever electronics in both units to shake hands with each other and as soon as the leisure batteries drop to a low level the whole system will become active. (A simple thought from a simple man)
Thanks
morristraveller- Member
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Posts : 24
Joined : 2020-08-22
Location : West Wales
Auto-Sleeper Model : Symbol+
Vehicle Year : 2019
Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
I posted elsewhere with my problems with the solar feed, which seems similar to yours. I eventually traced the fault to a bad connection on where the line from the regulator connects to the back of the Sargent panel. When the connection was not made, the light on the regulator goes out (battery) too.
Problem was solved by redoing the connection on the Sargent panel.
You problem might be different, but hope this helps
Problem was solved by redoing the connection on the Sargent panel.
You problem might be different, but hope this helps
gpilky- Member
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Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
morristraveller wrote:
Should I now deduce that the regulator is knackered, or that the output must be connected to the EC700 for the clever electronics in both units to shake hands with each other and as soon as the leisure batteries drop to a low level the whole system will become active. (A simple thought from a simple man)
Unfortunately you can't infer much from a test in which the solar controller is disconnected on its output side. Typically, when you power up a controller like that, the first thing it will do is to "probe" whatever is connected to its output to see whether the battery will accept a charge. This allows it to determine which of its charging modes to engage to charge the battery properly - if needed - or to go into "float" mode if not. It's hard to predict what a charger will do if it detects no battery-like voltage on the output terminals, but it doesn't seem unreasonable that it should give up and turn its output off if it detects no voltage.
Hopefully you will still find a wiring/connection problem somewhere, or discover (via other means) that the regulator is shagged, because either of those is a lot less aggravation than having to take the panel off and replace it!
Roopert- Member
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Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
The plot developed. I disconnected the flying lead from the solar panel and measured the voltage, 18v on an overcast afternoon
. Then I connected a car lamp bulb across the output of the panel, result : not a flutter of illumination from the lamp just and a reduced voltage down to 2 volts. This suggests to me a knackered panel.(Schottky diodes perhaps).
The van is under warranty but I don't trust the dealer (nor do half the population of Wales according to their online reviews). So I wanted to be prepared for any arguments. I will take the opportunity to upgrade the the size of the panel and controller if I can.
I'll give you some feedback........ wish me luck![up!](/users/3014/30/14/83/smiles/3459062273.gif)
![smile!](/users/3014/30/14/83/smiles/248932417.gif)
The van is under warranty but I don't trust the dealer (nor do half the population of Wales according to their online reviews). So I wanted to be prepared for any arguments. I will take the opportunity to upgrade the the size of the panel and controller if I can.
I'll give you some feedback........ wish me luck
![up!](/users/3014/30/14/83/smiles/3459062273.gif)
morristraveller- Member
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Posts : 24
Joined : 2020-08-22
Location : West Wales
Auto-Sleeper Model : Symbol+
Vehicle Year : 2019
Re: Symbol Plus -No Solar Output
morristraveller wrote:The plot developed. I disconnected the flying lead from the solar panel and measured the voltage, 18v on an overcast afternoon. Then I connected a car lamp bulb across the output of the panel, result : not a flutter of illumination from the lamp just and a reduced voltage down to 2 volts. This suggests to me a knackered panel.
I guess it depends on what power rating of bulb you connected. But the drop in voltage is exactly what you would expect if you have a good, working panel in low light levels. The panels (when working correctly) have a high internal resistance, so if you connect a (near-)short across the output, the voltage drops. It would not surprise me at all that a panel cannot light a filament bulb in relatively low light conditions.
Say, for example, that the bulb is a 21W brake light bulb. That requires near enough 2A to light at full brightness, which is nearly half of the (realistic) rated output of the panel. If you put 1A through that lamp, it would hardly light at all.
You may be right, and the panel may be faulty - but the evidence that you have there isn't conclusive.
Roopert- Member
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