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Smart and split chargers

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Smart and split chargers Empty Smart and split chargers

Post by LDPD Wed Mar 17, 2021 2:46 pm

I've noticed that the current AS site van specs mention a split charger whereas previously it was a smart charger. Anyone know anything about this update and what the split charger is? Is it an integrated Sargent update or something separate? Anyone have any info about this apparent change? We have a 2019 van with a 'smart charger and are aware of the extent of its smartness!

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Post by marconi Sat Mar 20, 2021 10:28 am

LDPD wrote:I've noticed that the current AS site van specs mention a split charger whereas previously it was a smart charger. Anyone know anything about this update and what the split charger is? Is it an integrated Sargent update or something separate? Anyone have any info about this apparent change? We have a 2019 van with a 'smart charger and are aware of the extent of its smartness!

Does this van spec include a Lithium Battery "new for 2021".
Vans always have a basic Split Charge Relay setup to charge the Leisure Battery when driving. This would not be suitable for Lithium so some form of Battery to Battery Converter is needed.

The 'Smart Charge' in our 2019 vans of course comes from the EC700, there is something that looks very much like an EC700 in the 2021 Lithium vans, have they changed it, it would just need a few bits pulling out.
Some Lithium vans have no Solar Panel, that removes one inefficiency in one function, such a van would not be for me.

Don't worry, A-S would never release anything inefficient and bug ridden, would they ?


Last edited by marconi on Sat Mar 20, 2021 1:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Guest Sat Mar 20, 2021 11:17 am

I agree, the ability to 'fast charge' (via a B-to-B charger when driving) shouldnt preclude the need/desire to replenish the 12v supply when on site/aire for a few days.
yes, the lithium might be able to be taken down much lower than typical batteries but, after recherging a couple of ebike batteries for a day or two, it makes little difference what its made of if its all gone👎
with many modern solar controllers being compatible with lithium, perhaps this should be the catalyst for installing them, not omitting them?
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Post by Peter Brown Sat Mar 20, 2021 11:55 am

I've just reviewed the technical specs on the whole 2021 range a published on the AS web site and they are all the same.

For clarity to the OP, the split charging system is used to join together the vehicle and leisure batteries when the engine is started so that they are both charged by the engine alternator. The smart charger is a 230v mains powered charger that is used to charge either or both vehicle and leisure battery when the van is pitched and on hook up.

Back to the specs, they all contain an 80w solar panel and TV aerial when I'd been given to understand they were being discontinued and there is no mention of the Lithium battery.

The Mercedes spec mentions split charging when in fact a B2B charger is used when the engine is running.

Take the published spec with a pinch of salt and get a spec signed off by your supplying dealer on placing your order.

Incidentally, smart alternators may no longer be flavour of the month. I've just acquired a 2021 mid range Mazda and it has an additional 24v battery that is charged by regenerative braking and powers a drive assist electric motor. I don't know what system the 2020/21 Peugeot and Fiat use?
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Post by LDPD Sat Mar 20, 2021 12:18 pm

marconi wrote:
LDPD wrote:I've noticed that the current AS site van specs mention a split charger whereas previously it was a smart charger. Anyone know anything about this update and what the split charger is? Is it an integrated Sargent update or something separate? Anyone have any info about this apparent change? We have a 2019 van with a 'smart charger and are aware of the extent of its smartness!

Does this van spec include a Lithium Battery "new for 2021".
Vans always have a basic Split Charge Relay setup to charge the Leisure Battery when driving. This would not be suitable for Lithium so some form of Battery to Battery Converter is needed.

The 'Smart Charge' in our 2019 vans of course comes from the EC700, there is something that looks very much like an EC700 in the 2021 Lithium vans, have they changed it, it would just need a few bits pulling out.
Some Lithium vans have no Solar Panel, that removes one inefficiency in one function, such a van would not be for me.

Don't worry, A-S ever would never release anything inefficient and bug ridden, would they ?

Our has a B2B split charger for when driving.

I spotted a change in spec from previously where a 'smart' charger was specifically mentioned, to a 'split' charger and was curious as to what this meant and what AS have done. Is it an efficiency update(improvement perhaps?) to maximise the benefit from any available solar.

Currently mulling over ideas to improve the current set up when off grid or in storage - first seems to be a split charger making the most of any solar. Probably followed by a panel with more output and then a larger capacity battery (lithium probably when the current battery dies or no longer meets our needs) It all depends on a more detailed analysis of our usage requirements. Currently our European travel plans are on hold until who knows when!

Have read many of the threads on here about the EC700 and lots of good info and advice but need to look carefully at our situation and what's best to do and when, if anything at all!

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Post by LDPD Sat Mar 20, 2021 12:22 pm

Peter Brown wrote:... The smart charger is a 230v mains powered charger that is used to charge either or both vehicle and leisure battery when the van is pitched and on hook up.

...
My understanding is that the smart charger works if the Sargent PSU is switched on regardless of whether on hookup or not. But I might be wrong.

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Post by Peter Brown Sat Mar 20, 2021 12:25 pm

The Smart Charger is the PX300. The Smart Charging facility you mention is in your EC700
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Post by Eltel Mon May 10, 2021 9:21 pm

I have a 2017 Nuevo as purchased except I have updated to two leisure batteries

I’m thinking this year and future years that I will be doing more rallies with either ASOC, CAMC and CCC

Reason being much better value for money and booking club & commercial sites difficult this year and expensive.

So my layman’s question is what should I be considering to increase the charging capacity both while driving and from the standard 80 solar panel.

As I have 240v supply while I am at hone this isn’t a issue (I think)

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Post by Libraryman2 Fri Mar 01, 2024 4:02 pm

Jumping on the back of this thread but I think it’s relevant.

Is the split charger relay incorporated into the ec500?

If not would anyone know where it is on a Corinium?

Ray

Having just posted this, I came across the following info on a wild camping forum….




Thanks to everyone for your replies. It is as suspected by 'mistericeman' and stated by Philip built into the Sargent EC500. I've spoken to Sargent Tech Support (very quick and very knowledgeable) who have confirmed this. 

(The Autosleepers handbook is very misleading as the wiring diagram shows a separate 70 Amp Split Charge Relay, then their (Autosleepers) Tech Support informed me that it's built into the EM40, that the relay on that unit is the Split Charge Relay. It isn't, it's the fridge relay. 

Even more confusing is if you trace the +ve Brown/Blue from the Leisure [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] you'll discover that it disappears into the wiring loom that heads away from the Sargent control box into the side panelling of the van, or at least it appears to. However if cut the cable ties holding the loom together and dig deep inside you'll discover a joint with two more Brown/ Blue wires that then head backwards into the EC500!)


Last edited by Libraryman2 on Fri Mar 01, 2024 4:09 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Addition of information)
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Post by PLOUGHLIN Fri Mar 01, 2024 4:04 pm

In the EM40 or 45 unit I believe.

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Post by Suppersready Fri Mar 01, 2024 4:10 pm

Libraryman2 wrote:Jumping on the back of this thread but I think it’s relevant.

Is the split charger relay incorporated into the ec500?

If not would anyone know where it is on a Corinium?

Ray
 

My split charge relay has stopped working … Sargent informed me it is part of the ec500

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Post by Suppersready Fri Mar 01, 2024 4:14 pm

Suppersready wrote:
 

My split charge relay has stopped working … Sargent informed me it is part of the ec500

Sorry ive caught up now …  smile!

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Post by v8oholic Fri Mar 01, 2024 7:10 pm

Rather than extracting and sending an EC500 off for repair, perhaps it might be more cost effective and quicker to add a new DC charger instead.
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Post by Suppersready Fri Mar 01, 2024 7:29 pm

v8oholic wrote:Rather than extracting and sending an EC500 off for repair, perhaps it might be more cost effective and quicker to add a new DC charger instead.

I agree and thank you for your suggestion … not being Sargent it will know doubt be a lot more reliable too.

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Post by Peter Brown Sat Mar 02, 2024 11:47 am

v8oholic wrote:Rather than extracting and sending an EC500 off for repair, perhaps it might be more cost effective and quicker to add a new DC charger instead.

Sargent now make an excellent DC to DC charger, see spec [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

If you had an EC700 you could deactivate the split charge relay with a menu option in the software.  For the EC500 you would have to physically modify the unit to disconnect the relay as, if its left in place, its operation will connect the output of the DC-DC charger to its own input and it wont charge the battery.
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Post by v8oholic Sat Mar 02, 2024 3:01 pm

Peter Brown wrote:

Sargent now make an excellent DC to DC charger, see spec [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

If you had an EC700 you could deactivate the split charge relay with a menu option in the software.  For the EC500 you would have to physically modify the unit to disconnect the relay as, if its left in place, its operation will connect the output of the DC-DC charger to its own input and it wont charge the battery.
If the EC500’s internal split charge relay is no longer functioning, would it need modifications? Broken and disabled are pretty similar.
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Post by Peter Brown Sat Mar 02, 2024 3:20 pm

It depends what is actually causing the fault and if its permanent.
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Post by Suppersready Sat Mar 02, 2024 3:47 pm

So either way, if I want the leisure batteries to charge while driving I may have no choice but to send the thing to Sargent.

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Post by Peter Brown Sat Mar 02, 2024 3:55 pm

Sargent may be able to advise a way for you to disconnect the relay without major surgery or another member may have done it - I'm not going to investigate in my EC500 whilst its working properly.
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Post by Suppersready Sat Mar 02, 2024 4:19 pm

Peter Brown wrote:Sargent may be able to advise a way for you to disconnect the relay without major surgery or another member may have done it - I'm not going to investigate in my EC500 whilst it’s working properly.

I will give Sargent a call … thank you.

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