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Broadway won’t start

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Post by Magrick on Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:53 pm

Still new to all this so a bit of a story.  Our van which we bought in august is 3 years old and we have done three or four short trips in it. Are last trip was only overnight and the adblue light came on, we put in a couple of litres but the adblue light did not go off.  We booked it in for a service at a local garage that does motorhomes. Unfortunately they were not able to clear the adblue light and said it needed to go to a Peugeot garage, which has been duly booked in. However, 2 days after the service we went to get something out of the van and 1) the alarm wouldn’t work 2) it wouldn’t unlock except manually 3) when we got into the van the dashboard was blinking and clicking widely and an alarm was going off quietly!    The van is supposed to go to the Peugeot dealer on Tuesday!! All a bit strange. Managed to see the control panel says poor vehicle battery but no idea why. It was driven for about 1 hour only 2 days ago.  We don’t leave it for very long between using it.  

HELP!
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Post by Fostersbob on Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:07 pm

I have a van conversion, same symptoms drove van for 2hours
Next day van will not unlock by fob .alarm inside going off.
Dash flickering changed vehicle battery all ok now. Hope this
May help.
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Post by Tinwheeler on Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:17 pm

Did you fill the AdBlue tank or just put in a couple of litres? I ask because there is a minimum amount required to reset the warnings and make the system work properly. From memory, I think it’s something like 5 litres.

However, there is more to this issue than just AdBlue and the battery must be suspect. A flat battery would certainly stop your auto unlocking system working which is exactly what happens when you use the battery isolation switch (if you have one).
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Post by Fostersbob on Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:28 pm

Sorry should have said don’t have adBlue or isolation switch 
But for a couple of months was had to unlock van with fob.
  Changed batteries in fob ok for short time but did not work.
    Then flat battery so I changed it so far so good.
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Post by Fostersbob on Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:43 pm

Sorry timwheeler didn’t read post correctly 
Thought it was from magrick .🤦‍�
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Post by Roopert on Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:51 pm

I don't know the Adblue system at all, but it may be that the warning for low Adblue level is preventing one of the van's control modules from going to sleep properly when it's locked, and that this has been the reason for the flat engine battery?

As you have a day before it needs to go to the garage, I would simply put the engine battery on charge (an independent good-quality charger such as a CTEK would be my preference, but putting it on hookup and selecting the engine battery may work - or it may blow the fuse in the charger circuit).

Alternatively - depending on its history - the engine battery may need replacing, as Fostersbob found. It's not unusual for the batteries in dealer-sourced vans to be in bad shape, as they tend to just leave them sitting on the forecourt for ages, and they may also move them around the site a lot, which gives too little running time to recharge the batteries.
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Post by glyne lock on Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:59 pm

Magrick wrote:Still new to all this so a bit of a story.  Our van which we bought in august is 3 years old and we have done three or four short trips in it. Are last trip was only overnight and the adblue light came on, we put in a couple of litres but the adblue light did not go off.  We booked it in for a service at a local garage that does motorhomes. Unfortunately they were not able to clear the adblue light and said it needed to go to a Peugeot garage, which has been duly booked in. However, 2 days after the service we went to get something out of the van and 1) the alarm wouldn’t work 2) it wouldn’t unlock except manually 3) when we got into the van the dashboard was blinking and clicking widely and an alarm was going off quietly!    The van is supposed to go to the Peugeot dealer on Tuesday!! All a bit strange. Managed to see the control panel says poor vehicle battery but no idea why. It was driven for about 1 hour only 2 days ago.  We don’t leave it for very long between using it.  

HELP!

the adblue will not reset by just filling up you need to do 2 runs then it should reset the next time you start up and may need to be filled up as twinwheeler has said.
can you put the van on ehu to charge up
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Post by Tinwheeler on Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:26 pm

Fostersbob wrote:Sorry timwheeler didn’t read post correctly 
Thought it was from magrick .🤦‍�
No worries  up!
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Post by Relaxez-Vous on Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:42 pm

Flat battery, lockdown's revenge?
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Post by inspiredron on Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:57 pm

The quiet alarm may well have been your control panel warning you of low battery. I suspect that if you read the vehicle battery voltage it will be below 10V. Out of interest I thought that my vehicle battery was ok a few months ago though I suspected it could be, after 8 years, on its way out. I spent about 20 minutes pumping up my rear tyres with an electric pump and then tried to start the engine. Flashing dashboard warnings, including the dreaded airbag and ABS failures with the MOT booked for two days time!  I recharged the battery and fortunately all warnings disappeared - didn't even lose my trip stats - and passed MOT. Battery was replaced two days later.

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Post by Magrick on Mon Nov 23, 2020 7:59 pm

Thanks for all the replies.  Forgot to say that the garage put another 4 litres of adblue in but said they couldn’t get the warning light to go out and we needed to take it to the Peugeot garage.  We have tried plugging the van in to EHU but that made no difference. Can’t seem to get the battery charged, it’s now been on trickle charge for a number of hours and the alarm is still quietly making a noise, but no difference to the battery.  Supposed to take it to Peugeot tomorrow but not if we can’t get it started!  Thanks again
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Post by rgermain on Mon Nov 23, 2020 8:48 pm

Don't you have home start breakdown?
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Post by IanH on Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:07 pm

Jump leads? There are connection points for them under the bonnet, see pics...
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Post by Magrick on Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:36 pm

Cheers chaps.  Really helpful.
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Post by easylifer on Tue Nov 24, 2020 12:55 pm

Magrick wrote:Cheers chaps.  Really helpful.
Don't forget to let us know the outcome, for future reference.
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Post by Magrick on Tue Nov 24, 2020 1:04 pm

Dont know what’s going on.  Tried trickle charge - no good, tried jump start - no good (although the dash did light up) off to get some jump leads to start it from our car (hopefully). Just one more question - we did put it on EHU, which didn’t seem to make any difference- however should I have put the control panel on while it’s on EHU?. So much to learn - why doesn’t someone do courses on the electrics!  They teach you how to drive it - that’s the easy bit!
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Post by Magrick on Tue Nov 24, 2020 1:18 pm

Also meant to say the van was working 3 days ago when it had an engine service.  Could the battery have gone flat that quickly.  It is only showing 5.5 v
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Post by inspiredron on Tue Nov 24, 2020 1:36 pm

On my control panel, (EC328) the control panel must be switched on to enable selection of vehicle battery charging.

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Post by Cymro on Tue Nov 24, 2020 3:17 pm

Magrick wrote:Dont know what’s going on.  .....  tried jump start - no good (although the dash did light up) off to get some jump leads to start it from our car (hopefully).....

Not sure I understand the above. It seems to suggest that you didn't have jump leads when you tried to jump start??

With proper jump leads connected to the two dedicated points so helpfully shown in IanH's photos, the engine should start unless there's another issue, such as a fuel delivery problem.   I don't know enough, but if a solenoid were stuck (e.g. fuel pump or whatever) could that flatten battery even if ignition was off?

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Post by IanH on Tue Nov 24, 2020 3:29 pm

Magrick
No wish to teach granny to suck eggs, but once jump leads are safely connected, run the donor car engine at a fast idle for a good 10 mins or so, before even trying to start the van, also have it at fast idle when starting the van as well.
This should put some charge into the battery to assist the jump leads, it is unlikely that enough current will pass through them to start the engine, remember the heater plugs will come on when you try to start, they take a considerable current, though only for a short time
Good Luck!
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Post by Magrick on Tue Nov 24, 2020 4:53 pm

Thanks again chaps. The original jump leads were quite small so OM went and bought industrial size jump leads that did the trick.  Took it to the garage who reset it all.  Still not sure why it went flat but it’s ok for now. Might get a new battery although garage said it looked quite new.
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Post by glyne lock on Tue Nov 24, 2020 6:01 pm

IanH wrote:Magrick
No wish to teach granny to suck eggs, but once jump leads are safely connected, run the donor car engine at a fast idle for a good 10 mins or so, before even trying to start the van, also have it at fast idle when starting the van as well.
This should put some charge into the battery to assist the jump leads, it is unlikely that enough current will pass through them to start the engine, remember the heater plugs will come on when you try to start, they take a considerable current, though only for a short time
Good Luck!
You need to put the lights on to tell the alternator to put out charge or if not it thinks the battery is charged so well not put charge to the jump leads. 
You should also put the side lights on when you start the flat battery vehicle this then stops damage to the ecu
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Post by IanH on Tue Nov 24, 2020 9:02 pm

New one on me Glyne. Can't begin to guess how many ancient bangers I started (yrs ago) with just jump leads and a running engine. Surely the alternator now sees both batteries as one via the jump leads so the alternator will do all it can to charge what it "thinks" is it's battery just needing a charge?
Either way, seems it worked for Magrick!
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Post by glyne lock on Tue Nov 24, 2020 10:29 pm

if the battery on  the vehicle that's running is fully charged the alternator does not keep charging so to get the alternator  to put out a charge you put a direct load(making the regulator sens the voltage drop) by putting the lights on this will then  charge the battery and you can then even start with thin leads .any vehicle with a ecu you should put the side lights on  the flat battery vehicle before you start it the side lights then takes the surge from the alternator and not the ecu and damaging it .this is why you should put some charge as you had said Ian first for 10mins + with jump leads with a very flat battery and then the alternator will not put such a high surge doing any damage.
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Post by Roopert on Tue Nov 24, 2020 11:02 pm

glyne lock wrote:if the battery on  the vehicle that's running is fully charged the alternator does not keep charging so to get the alternator  to put out a charge you put a direct load(making the regulator sens the voltage drop) by putting the lights on

That's a completely new one on me too. Quite why the regulator would see the small current being taken by the sidelights as a "direct load", but not see the large current going down the jump lead wires to a flat battery on the other vehicle is beyond me.

Both of those things take their power from the same place - it's not possible for the current to the jump leads to somehow "avoid" the regulator, because it's essentially a voltage-sensing device. It's true that alternators and the associated charging systems have got more sophisticated in recent years - so for example it's quite common for the charging system to be able to turn off high consumption items such as a heated rear window - but that won't apply in this case.

In very recent years, smart alternators have become even more complicated due to start/stop systems and regenerative braking but, again, those systems won't just ignore the fact that you've got a flat battery pulling down the voltage of the "donor" battery. In that situation, the charging system may not "see" the current being taken out of the battery (depending on exactly how you connect the jump leads to the battery), but it will certainly "see" the battery voltage drop!

Adding in the load of the sidelights won't make a (useful) difference in either of those cases. It's just a waste of a bit of the alternator's output - though I'd agree that in the overall scheme of things it's probably not enough to be detrimental in any big way.
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