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mysterious beeping 2013 Nuevo EK - part II

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Post by Allan on March 30th 2020, 8:49 am

Hi folks - first of all many thanks to all who have offered  helpful suggestions to help me to track down the source of the mysterious 1 second-duration  beeps (every 90 seconds) coming from the rear of thus Peugeot boxer vehicle. (Nuevo EK 2013) After following up all the suggestions, I now note that the Sargent digital display (for the EC328 power supply unit) shows that there is a continuous minus 11.3amps current being drawn from the selected battery (either leisure and vehicle). The battery charger is currently switched on. So...is the intermittent beeping indicating that one or both batteries (leisure /vehicle) is becoming flattened prior to being recharged by the charger?I'm at a a loss to understand things - as everything else is switched off. I'm wondering whether I should just disconnect both batteries for the time being, until I can get a vehicle electrician to check out things. Can I ask whether this is a good idea? Are there any side effects to disconnecting batteries?
Cheers
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Post by Paulmold on March 30th 2020, 9:28 am

I think you need to recalibrate your panel. A drain of 11amp cannot be right.

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Post by PLOUGHLIN on March 30th 2020, 10:30 am

Paulmold wrote:I think you need to recalibrate your panel. A drain of 11amp cannot be right.

+1

Section 7 Common Faults in the AS Manual explains how.

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Post by Gromit on March 30th 2020, 11:49 am

Hi Allan

This may (does  shrugg) sound faintly ridiculous, but it happened to me so I'll tell you . . . just for interest?

I had a similar experience, and thought it was a low battery warning from something like a phone or smoke alarm, but was quite unable to trace the beep.

To cut a long story short, I finally realised it's a form of tinnitus. Irregular and intermittent beeps, only really noticeable when it's very quiet, like when in bed.

I was convinced it was a real sound, and spent ages trying to find it but obviously with no success, until I finally realised what it was. It lasted only about a fortnight, co-incidentally while we were away in the van, since when I've not experienced it again. 

I should add that I've had permanent tinnitus for as long as I can remember, but I rarely even think about it as it's automatically "tuned out" for most of the time.
This won't help with your frustration - but it might be of interest to fellow tinnitus sufferers?  think_smiley_46
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Post by Allan on March 30th 2020, 5:50 pm

Thanks Paulmold, Ploughlin and Gromit...
1. Both my wife & I can hear the beeps- so no tinnitus (thank god!)- it's a definite beep 
2.  Re: re-calibrating the control panel..Paul, I'm not sure how this would solve the problem (and thanks for the section 7 handbook reference, Ploughlin)... It says you would do it if the current reading is incorrect - but can I be sure that it is incorrect? 


Further information is that with electric hook-up...when checking the Sargent display for current draw (showing minus 11.5 amps - ranging up to 11.8 amps...a constantly changing flickering figure) and simultaneously switching the Battery charger OFF (on the EC328 power control unit in the wardrobe) , the current reading goes up to 12.3 - 12.4 amps. 
My thinking is that... when the battery charger is OFF, without this support, the battery needs to use more amps to feed whatever it is that's powering....as you say Paul," a drain of 11 amps can't be right"
So.....without being able to figure out why the battery is discharging current (and causing a beep every 90 seconds), I'm wondering whether it might be best to disconnect the leisure battery until I can get to an auto electrician - would there be any downside/disadvantages to doing this?
It might also stop the beeping!
Thanks all for your inputs - much appreciated
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Post by Roopert on March 30th 2020, 5:59 pm

I can't recall the exact history of this because for some reason you've stopped posting in the original thread - which contained all of the background info - and started a new one.

But if the drain of 11 Amps were correct, the battery would be dead flat in less than 10 hours. Is it? If so, then you have a massive drain somewhere. It should be easy to track down, because anything that is taking 11 Amps continuously when it shouldn't will be getting very hot.

If the battery is not completely flat in 10 hours, it's fair to assume that the calibration needs redoing. Once that is done you will get a more accurate figure of the current drain.
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Post by Paulmold on March 30th 2020, 6:23 pm

Once recalibrated, you will know if the beep stops or not, if it stops then recalibration is all that was needed.

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Post by Molly3 on March 30th 2020, 9:26 pm

I think you need to check the current with a multi meter or DC clamp meter . your Sargent may be giving totally wrong readings.
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Post by Molly3 on March 30th 2020, 9:27 pm

I think you need to check the current with a multi meter or DC clamp meter . your Sargent may be giving totally wrong readings.
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Post by glyne lock on March 30th 2020, 10:39 pm

I would not be saying to use a multi meter molly3 as most are only 10 amp and if there is a drain of 11 amp will damage the meter .just test voltage to day then tomorrow as Roopert has said
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Post by Molly3 on March 31st 2020, 2:09 am

I did ad or a DC clamp meter mine reads 60 amp
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Post by Molly3 on March 31st 2020, 2:15 am

Has the water tank heater been left on ?
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Post by Allan on March 31st 2020, 9:02 am

Thanks folks, once again 
I don't have a multi or a DC clamp meter, so I'm stuck there in these times of no-travel. Heater???My thoughts too, Molly3 but...no, the water heater hasn't been left on.There's an illuminated isolater switch in the wardrobe which I've switched off to be sure. Today I'm planning to switch off the battery charger and check if, and how quickly, the battery loses power. If it does lose power then it looks like there is some unknown thing that's draining the battery. I'm at a loss as to where to go next, except to consider disconnecting the battery until more normal times come round again.
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Post by bolero boy on March 31st 2020, 9:09 am

i dont know if the panel readings can help or not....some doubt as to recalibration....however, if you can get voltage readings then, with the charger on, it should be reading either 14.4v or 13.9v at float level.

but...as above, with charger off after an hour or so you should see the battery settle to its real level....if its anywhere near 12.6v/12.7v then the battery is fully charged.....be wise to check again 24 nrs later.

if the battery is showing 12.2v/12.4v then its low to dying...
anything less than 12.2v and its probably gone.

but with the current draw the panel is indicated then, as above, this battery couldnt last one day without dying...

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Post by PLOUGHLIN on March 31st 2020, 9:29 am

Allan, do the recalibration, it can do no harm, is quick and easy. It may not change the apparent high current drain, but might remove a worry and stop you chasing a non-existent fault.

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Post by glyne lock on March 31st 2020, 10:16 am

Allan
as Roopert  Bolero boy and myself have said do the battery test first this will tell us if you have got a drain .if the battery looks ok then do the recalibration. if you have got a drain next in to start removing the fuses. I will explain so  come back with the battery test first
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Post by Torbaytimber on March 31st 2020, 3:24 pm

Just a thought.  Had a bleeping that I could not trace in an Autotrail Tracker.  In the end it turned out to be the smoke alarm needing a new battery.
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Post by Dbvwt on March 31st 2020, 5:08 pm

Torbaytimber wrote:Just a thought.  Had a bleeping that I could not trace in an Autotrail Tracker.  In the end it turned out to be the smoke alarm needing a new battery.

Nice thought Torbaytimber but I think that was tried in Series 1, Episode 1 by the original O/P.

Sorry all, I couldn’t help myself smile!
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Post by Allan on March 31st 2020, 5:19 pm

Thanks Torbaytimber - both alarm batteries changed. 
1. I'm not sure how to do a battery check - what equipment do I need to do this?
2. Done a re-calibration this a.m. ...the digital display now shows the battery current readings 
with charger ON  @                + 0.3.......amps
with charger OFF @ - (minus) - 0.1/-0.2 amps
3. The leisure battery shows as GOOD  13.4 V.
4. The Vehicle battery shows as GOOD 13.3 V.
But....the beeping is still there every 90 seconds!!
I suppose I'm thinking that if it's doing no harm then I should stop worrying about it, but a beeping usually mean that there is a problem, and this is still mystifying me.  That's why I wondered whether to disconnect the leisure battery for the duration of this lockdown.
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Post by Roopert on March 31st 2020, 5:32 pm

Allan wrote:That's why I wondered whether to disconnect the leisure battery for the duration of this lockdown.

It's something that should be almost trivial to try, though I suspect that if most of the suggestions are right, you will find that the beeps will continue after you have disconnected the leisure battery - because the beeping is ~probably~ a warning that the internal battery of the device that is bleeping is running out...
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Post by Peter Brown on March 31st 2020, 5:45 pm

I suggested some time ago that you removed the batteries from the smoke and carbon monoxide alarms, I haven'r read that you have tried this.

The reason I suggested doing that was that an alarm unit may be faulty and generating a low battery alarm falsely. Its no good just removing the battery for a short period of time as energy is stored in the circuitry. Take them out until you have found the source of the beep.
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Post by Allan on March 31st 2020, 7:59 pm

Ok - again thanks for suggestions/thoughts - I'll remove the smoke/carbon mono. alarms' batteries.
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Post by gassygassy on April 1st 2020, 8:48 pm

The Final Solution is . . . .
Just wait till you are 70 yrs old. Your tinnitus will overtake the beep in volume, and your hearing will have deteriorated so you can't hear it anyway. Our fridge freezer in the kitchen is apparently beeping much to the annoyance of Mrs Fragrant, but as I can't hear it and the fridge and freezer are fine, I can't be bothered with it.
I sometimes get a very odd sound in addition to my tinnitus. It is like a lorry slowly labouring up a hill, and it comes on and switches off. It is at a very low frequency, quite the opposite of tinnitus and the cadence varies totally randomly. Wierd. The solution of course is to turn up the volume of The Who playing 'won't get fooled again'. Preferably with big headphones on.
Which has nothing to do with your beep. Personally I would disconnect the mains supply and the leisure battery, leave it for an hour or two and see if it is still there. However some 'low battery' warnings on devices can run for days and days with no external power. I think it is quite easy to remove the Sargent control panel, you could remove it to a safe place and see if the noise goes with it. I think what ever you do will end up needing to be off for maybe a week, because these alarm things can run off button cells fixed into the device.
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Post by Molly3 on April 1st 2020, 10:37 pm

You could go to Sargent website and email them your problems .I have contacted them twice and have received their advice ,they do take a few days to reply .
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Post by Knick-Knack on April 1st 2020, 10:51 pm

Allan

If you are unable to determine precisely where the beep is coming from:

1. Get a short length of pipe.  (22mm copper would be good, perhaps about 450mm long.)

2.  Put your finger in one ear.

3. Put one end of the copper pipe (gently) to your other ear.

4. Sit comfortably in your van, and wait for 90 seconds, as many times as it takes.

5. Don't let anyone see you, in case they think you have flipped.

If you are lucky (which I must admit on current evidence might be over-optimistic) you might be able to pin down where the beep is coming from.

Nick

PS  You can put the pipe down now, and take your finger out of your ear.
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