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WARNING FOR BROADWAY OWNERS....

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Post by big'nuf on Sun Jul 15, 2018 10:40 pm

Just returned from a 3500 mile trip around France and Spain as last voyage in my 2015 AS Broadway before trading it in for a Pilote.
Brilliant trip - drove well and did everything it was meant to, averaged 32 MPG...all good except one serious issue I think you should be aware of.

I was driving at a steady 60 in cruise control on a toll road when my engine suddenly lost all power immediately, the engine management light came on and the warning panel said "Check Engine".
I spoke with Peugeot who agreed that I could possibly re set it by disconnecting the battery...if the light didn't come on immediately on start up it could be a temporary fault...
I disconnected the battery, waited 2 minutes, re connected then started the engine. The light went out, as did the check-engine warning. The van has driven fine ever since with no issues....
BUT
I was travelling with our friends who have an identical van (but 2014).
On the last but one day, he overtook a big lorry whilst in cruise control....as he tucked back infront of the truck his engine died suddenly (like mine) nearly causing a serious and dangerous collision with the lorry who managed to slam on his brakes, hang on his horn and hail a lot of abuse at my friends (understandably).
He pulled into the hard shoulder, switched off then switched back on and continued to the next aires.
His engine management light was on and warning Check Engine notice .....exactly the same as mine a week earlier in Spain.
I re set his light etc, the same as I did mine, and he has not had a problem since. (2 days ago).

This nearly caused a fatal collision so I feel people should be aware of this.
Does Autosleeper know about this issue?
Does Peugeot know of this issue?
Has anyone else had this problem?
Has this topic been covered before?

I would accept it as a glitch if it had just happened to mine....but to the two of us within such a short time?
My van has 8,000 miles on it and my friends have 11,000 miles. Nothing really.
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Post by Maasai Warrior on Sun Jul 15, 2018 11:01 pm

It will be interesting if others have had the same issues as you and your friends have had. We have never had the problem but we have never used cruise control, and having read your posting, I will not use it in the future. I personally have never seen the need for cruise control. Interesting we have had our instrument panel changed under warranty. It has been said that using cruise control can cause unusual light combinations coming on the dash. Whether there is any connection, who knows, it’s all magic to me. We have had issues with the engine management light coming on and the Peugeot engine going into limp mode. This took Peugeot technicians a week to sort out. All now ok so far, but I will still not use cruise control.

Peugeots need to know how serious it could have been for you both! Our van has done nearly 11,000 miles so far, with lots of high speed motorway driving. Thanks for the warning!

Pete
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Post by inspiredron on Sun Jul 15, 2018 11:28 pm

I had the same issue on my Euro V Lancashire in 2012 - not on cruise control and not on a motorway but fortunately on a single carriageway 2 lane road while travelling at around 25mph. Suddenly lost all power and engine management light came on plus a text mesage on the dashboard.  Pulled in to kerb, turned of ignition and the restarted.  Drove gently to Peugeot dealer in Rijeka who did an almost instant computer check but then had to send diagnostics to Zagreb for interpretation as i twas first Euro V they had seen.  EGR failure was the diagnosis - it had stuck.  I was offered choice of 3 days for part from Paris or drive home. We took the latter and got home OK (including one nday with 450 miles on autobahns).  Local dealer checked and NFF! No recurrence since.

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Post by Paulmold on Mon Jul 16, 2018 8:20 am

Obviously this could apply to any model built on the Boxer and not just the Broadway.

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Post by Mike187 on Mon Jul 16, 2018 8:59 am

I wouldn't think cruise control would be a contributing factor as well but certainly something that Peugeot should be made aware of.
Not a fan of cruise control although occasionally do use it usually at a lower speed that I would normally drive at. Always thought it should have been introduced with a systems that at least disengages it if you got too close to the vehicle in front.

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Post by Bad Penny on Mon Jul 16, 2018 9:18 am

This problem sounds like the turbo waste gate valve sticking, this will shut down the power to avoid damage to the engine.

If this is the problem, this valve can be cleaned, does not have to changed.
When having my vehicle serviced my garage would clean this as a matter of course.
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Post by Cymro on Mon Jul 16, 2018 11:24 am

Had same problem, twice. Worst was on M4 when it suddenly went into limp mode. Driving on hard shoulder at 20mph is not for the faint hearted .... especially where hard shoulder peters out for a bridge etc. Rejoining carriageway, where trucks are doing 60mph, is frightening.

Can't remember what caused it - was at Peugeot for a week - someting to do with fuel injection system. Switching off and on "cured" it the first time, but not the second when on M4. Nowt to do with cruise control.

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Post by wwinky on Mon Jul 16, 2018 12:08 pm

Presently having same problem with my 2016 Broadway happens intermittently ignition off and on engine runs normally
I never use cruise control so fault not related
I spoke to two campers on site in Barra and mentioned this one had this happening to his Fiat in the past and the second had the same fault at present so it would appear to be a common fault
I am taking my Broadway to a Peugeot dealer in eight days time for investigation will let you know how I get on
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Post by meanchris on Mon Jul 16, 2018 1:56 pm

Could it be worth investing in a Bluetooth OBDII reader and a diagnostic app such as Torque Pro, total cost around £10.

I had this problem on my Saab convertible twice recently, first time in the 50mph roadworks at J3 with very heavy and tightly bunched traffic, including the Artic' right up my exhaust pipe. I managed to nurse the car along with judicious use of the almost unresponsive throttle, as there's nowhere to stop in the roadworks, until I could get onto the hard shoulder near to the M42 junction.
Restarting the engine didn't clear the fault, but it did allow me to drive normally once again.
Once I got home I used the BT adapter and Torque (that I bought to look at the EMU light fault on our previous 2.8HDi Executive, which turned out to be the wastegate stuck closed) and noted the fault code, as well as clear it.

A local Saab specialist couldn't find anything wrong with the car, so I began to carry the BT adapter with me all the time.
A few weeks ago, I had the same problem (it does it on heavy overrun, for those who may be interested, and reports "Powertrain Air Inlet Leak - P2279), but this time I was able to clear the fault at the roadside and continue, being careful to not allow too much overrun by not changing down manually (it's an auto) to use engine braking.

Not a shaggy dog story, more to suggest that it's wise to carry a device that can be used to clear intermittent EMU fault codes (after writing them down of course), and allow you to continue safely.

I too am horrified, that what is a relatively minor intermittent fault, could potentially have killed me or my wife by reducing our ability to safely control the vehicle in heavy fast moving traffic.
I think that manufacturers should be urged to change the way that the vehicle electronics responds to fault, at least to allow the vehicle to be stopped safely, not by severely crippling it instantaneously.
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Post by dbroada on Mon Jul 16, 2018 3:53 pm

I'll join in with a limp mode tale. Hurrying to take my mum to hospital I had pulled in to lane 2 on the Caterham bypass about to overtake a Transit in my diesel Smart foot down and nothing. The Transit was now about 2 mph faster than me and the next car in my lane was approaching rather quickly. Fortunately I managed to get back to lane 1 without creating an accident but we were now in a queue for the motorway and I had to follow all the other traffic not knowing what state my car was in.

Eventually managed to tell mum to get a taxi and by turning the ignition off and on the fault cleared, not yet having returned.

As meanchris says above, it's not the fact an error (possibly erronius) is flagged, it's that you are left so vulnerable is the problem.

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Post by -mojo- on Mon Jul 16, 2018 4:00 pm

It's a difficult one for the manufacturers, because on most engines there are a number of faults that ~could~ lead to engine damage fairly quickly if ignored

The unfortunate fact is that many people (especially hire and company car drivers) will just drive on if a light comes up on the dash! So they have to resort to tactics such as "limp mode" to get people to take the situation seriously.
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Post by meanchris on Mon Jul 16, 2018 4:25 pm

-mojo- wrote:It's a difficult one for the manufacturers, because on most engines there are a number of faults that ~could~ lead to engine damage fairly quickly if ignored

The unfortunate fact is that many people (especially hire and company car drivers) will just drive on if a light comes up on the dash! So they have to resort to tactics such as "limp mode" to get people to take the situation seriously.

Maybe a temporary "Emergency Cancel" would be safer than putting lives at risk with no warning?
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Post by burlingtonboaby on Mon Jul 16, 2018 5:52 pm

Not wanting to go over old ground,however  all of my Peugeot vans have had EGR failures, my last van had to have a turbo replaced,due  to the waste gate sticking shut.replaced the EGR valve the previous year.
59 Symbol 8000 miles ,replace EGR valve (under warranty )
09 Nuevo es ,around 18400 miles,still under Marquis3year warranty, turned down claim. For EGR valve.
Wrote and e-mailed Peugeot U.K , acknowledged receiving e-mail only, failing on deaf ears.
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Post by Paramedic on Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:09 pm

inspiredron wrote:  Drove gently to Peugeot dealer in Rijeka who did an almost instant computer check but then had to send diagnostics to Zagreb for interpretation as i twas first Euro V they had seen.  EGR failure was the diagnosis - it had stuck.  
We've suffered limp mode very shortly after leaving camp site at Chideock when climbing a long steep hill towards Lyme Regis. Frantically dropping down the gears trying to keep revs up, finally reach the brow and just managed to get most of van off carriageway into someone's driveway. Coach immediately behind blasts horn in frustration (b......d) obviously not realising our predicament. Despite delightful RAC man's computer not recognising the Peugeot engine he tapped somewhere with his screwdriver that cured the problem, stuck EGR. He followed us for several miles (he suggested at speed) to a prearranged petrol filling station to confirm no further problem. Perhaps the cause was the hill climb so soon after leaving the campsite due to cold engine and low revs but am aware the DPF can cause same problem. So now always keep high revs at start of journey until engine reaches a higher temperature....... mm, so fickle these diesels seem to be in order to save the planet and finally, won't engage cruise control as definitely not looking for unnecessary trouble. smile!

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Post by inspiredron on Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:58 pm

Basically current emissions targets are so tight that manufacturers are putting in all kinds of devices that do the job of keeping the emisions down at the cost of increasing unreliability of the engine!  Why should they care - They are restricted by law!

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Post by groundhog on Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:29 pm

Please excuse me but I can see no correlation between using cruise control and an EGR fault causing an engine to go in to limp mode, or, any other fault for that matter? Am I missing something!
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Post by Maasai Warrior on Mon Jul 16, 2018 8:15 pm

Yes, more than likely no connection whatsoever! But no way am I going to tempt fate by using cruise control ever!  We have had our problems with our Broadway over the years including it leaping into limp mode. We are enjoying a period of trouble free motoring at the moment, (that’s done it!), however it will not take much for us to get rid, if anything else happens! We are not amused as some of you know!

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Post by groundhog on Mon Jul 16, 2018 8:28 pm

Over many years I have owned cars and vans with cruise control, use it constantly and never had a failure with any of them?

If it isn't for you though then it isn't, I am shocked at how many people here do not use it.

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Post by meanchris on Mon Jul 16, 2018 8:29 pm

I use it, on both cars and on our van.  wave content
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Post by Maasai Warrior on Mon Jul 16, 2018 8:40 pm

Only any good on empty roads IMHO! - But we are going off thread.

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Post by -mojo- on Mon Jul 16, 2018 8:51 pm

groundhog wrote:Please excuse me but I can see no correlation between using cruise control and an EGR fault causing an engine to go in to limp mode, or, any other fault for that matter? Am I missing something!

The reason why Cruise Control can cause underlying minor faults to manifest themselves is because a typical CC will keep increasing throttle input (electronically) on a hill until the right foot is (electronically) flat on the floor, and will keep it there until the end of the hill. Most drivers won't do that if pressing the accelerator themselves - they will (usually) notice and either ease off a little or change down a gear - or both.

An example of where this matters is where you have a slight air leak in between the turbo and the inlet of the engine (either through a split hose, or a damaged seal, or a split/hole in the intercooler), or where one of the engine sensors is out of spec. In this case there will be a mismatch between the boost that the ECU is demanding and the actual measurements that the MAF and MAP sensors are detecting. This mismatch increases as the power demand gets bigger, so it is most likely to be detected with the accelerator flat on the floor.

I should add that I have no aversion to using the cruise control on my van and anything else I drive that has it - for me it's a very good way to alleviate the pain that I get in the right knee on long motorway journeys. But I'm not very good at assessing the steepness of motorway hills, so I use an Engine Load readout on the dash to help me in knowing when to make downchanges.
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Post by groundhog on Mon Jul 16, 2018 9:37 pm

Thanks for that explanation mojo allthumbz
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Post by big'nuf on Mon Jul 16, 2018 10:14 pm

all interesting stuff...thanks to all for the comments.
Neither of our vans went into limp mode, they simply lost all power instantly.
I have had an enormous amount of cars and vans and have always used cruise on a regular basis...never a problem until this time. I will continue to use cruise on my new van too....even though its still a Fiat Ducato based van...
Broadway gone now...will miss it
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Post by wwinky on Tue Jul 31, 2018 5:53 pm

Peugeot fitted new fuel injector to my van and regenerated dpf filter done under warranty time will tell if this solves my problem garage seemed pretty confident
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Post by crumb on Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:53 pm

I've just come across this post and the only thing I can think of to link the two vehicles from the original post is fuel, did they both fill up at the same service station? The reason I mention this is I own a Jag, it doesn't like supermarket fuel, it has cut out a few times on said fuel, once I realised this and started using branded fuel I've never had a problem, just a belated thought.
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