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Post by Bad Penny on Mon Apr 08, 2019 5:01 pm

I am far from being an angel, but I do notice the kind of descriptive demeaning language now being used by some on this forum, when posting, referring to other groups of people who they seem to find objectionable.scratch head Respect is what I thought  this forum stood for, not name calling.

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Post by bikeralw on Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:03 pm

Can you be a bit more specific Leighton? I keep up with most posts, at least those that interest me, and I've not noticed anything objectionable since the spat in January.
Maybe it's just a sign of the divisive times we're living in. 
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Post by Bad Penny on Tue Apr 09, 2019 12:13 am

Hi bikeralw. I think when terms like frogs and pikeys are used to describe certain people, it's insulting and I think, lowers the tone of this forum. It does happen on other forums, I thought this one was better than that.

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Post by harrysp on Tue Apr 09, 2019 7:56 am

Fully support this Leighton. Glad you said this as I had noticed too.

Thanks.

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Post by bikeralw on Tue Apr 09, 2019 9:27 am

Ah, thanks for clarifying Leighton. I must have missed the post or posts where those terms were used.
 I do remember a few years ago when the word 'Gypos' was mentioned on here, the person got a warning from a moderator I believe.

I've just returned from NZ where the native Maori call the white New Zealanders 'Pakeha', insult or not, no one seems to take offence.
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Post by rogerblack on Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:51 am

The joys (or not) of Political Correctness!
When I moved down south in my teens/early twenties, in different work/social circles I was known as Jock/Jocky, Haggis or Scotty, seldom by my given name.  It was never intended disrespectfully, nor taken as such. My Welsh friend was called Taffy, there were several Paddys and a Caribbean-born friend, who today I believe we'd have to refer to as 'a person of colour', was called Chalky by all of us in the group. None of this was considered offensive or racist, nicknames were considered more like terms of endearment - in fact anyone we weren't keen on we never bothered giving any nickname.

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Post by Roopert on Tue Apr 09, 2019 12:08 pm

Certainly gypsies have one or more terms that they use to describe people other than gypsies - "gorgio" or "gorger" is sometimes heard in a village near here - generally intended as not complimentary.

It's a complex subject - for example the p-word used in the thread that I think Leighton refers to is not one that people of gypsy background would associate with, and few gypsies seem to identify in any way with the relatively modern "traveller" population.

It's also interesting in that this thread led me to look up gypsy-origin words, and it's surprising how many have found their way into fairly common use (examples: chivvy, maunder, lush, barney), though I suspect that many of those don't get used - with a gypsy meaning - much outside London...

And as Roger says, some words have only become "offensive" recently. My Dad never got out of the habit of calling people with dark skin "coloured", long after it had become "offensive", without realising. I believe the background to the n-word is similar.
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Post by bikeralw on Tue Apr 09, 2019 12:56 pm

As an example of this up until recently I thought the term 'half-caste' was an ok term to use, and much more respectful than coloured. I've since been re-educated into saying 'mixed race', but how long before that is also deemed to be politically incorrect..
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Post by rgermain on Tue Apr 09, 2019 1:48 pm

Does this also apply to dogs, 4 legged type that is? I am just about to renew the insurance and found out if I change from declared last year from "mixed breed" to "crossbreed" I save £10 a month.  Same old dog though.
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Post by Bad Penny on Tue Apr 09, 2019 2:03 pm

Yes I agree totally about nick names, jock and taffy are not in any way derogatory. I am highlighting those terms used,  because of the general tone of the remarks made, I felt they were aggressive and disrespectful.

The test is, would you use those terms in front of the people or person they were aimed at.

I'm not talking about political correctness here, but to be mindful of good manners when posting. There is enough of the other on the streets, we don't want it here as well.

Leighton.
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Post by daisy mae on Wed Apr 10, 2019 1:50 am

In my understanding Gipsies are not classed in the same way as travellers. 

Gipsies are the real thing, I have been to a Gipsy camp and sat at the table with them, everything was spotless, their dress, caravans / wagons and they had Royal Albert tableware. was made very welcome and invited to sit with them.

I was researching my family history,  as my Great, Great  Grandparents were Gipsies, these Gipsyies were telling me where the best place to go to see that strain their camp, 

Have any of you read Jesse Smith`s books,? there are five altogether, , all about the real families of Gipsies. of which Jessie is one of them. I have, and aim to follow their journeys  through Scotland.

The travellers as they are called, live in a tip leave their rubbish and cost councils thousands, a different kettle of fish.

I have mentioned before about the Gipsies on this forum, and nothing was said about it to me. it isn`t correct to lump them with the travellers.

Before anyone jumps on the bandwagon, I am NOT BEING RACIST or disrespectful, just saying like it is.

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Post by rose49f on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:18 am

I think we're all gypsies at heart. This is why we have vans and enjoy travelling. But I'm going off thread here.
I can't say I've seen any disrespectful language in here but then l don't read every post. When you see it again perhaps complain to the moderators and they can put a stop to it.
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Post by Paulmold on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:31 am

I don't think anyone has complained about the use of 'gypsies' or 'travellers' and I think we all know the difference. What has been complained about are the terms 'pikeys' and 'frogs' and 'froggie land'.

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Post by rose49f on Wed Apr 10, 2019 10:53 am

As we on this forum are mostly of the 'older' generation these were used years ago and l suppose they come out without realising. I once said about a lovely suit to a friend of mine. "That colour is a lovely n____r brown to which she promptly said l couldn't say that anymore. Her husband is black and yes we are still friends.
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Post by rogerblack on Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:16 am

Obviously, the term 'Frogs' for French folk comes from what we understand to be part of their diet; you probably already know that they reciprocate by referring to us Brits as 'Rosbifs'. 

I have always thought of these as jocular, friendly terms rather than offensive.

I made a sign which I often put up in the rear window when travelling in France, referencing this as well as one of my favourite Monsieur Hulot films:  

 "Le Vacances de M. et Mme. Rosbif"

which includes a McGill type cartoon of a sunburnt pair in cozzies.

This has often been a great icebreaker with locals (les Grenouilles!) on French sites.

Sadly, too many folk today take offence where none is intended. And frequently on behalf of a group to which they don't even belong.

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Post by roli on Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:31 am

After it was brought to our attention I edited pikeys out of the the original post.  Suspect the French reference was taken out by CC or the original poster.
Could I ask that we now drop this topic and do bear in mind what might be normal language to us on a day to day basis can not be written on here. There are rules we have to stick to and certainly dont want problems over the site for Admin
Thanks in anticipation folks

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Post by rogerblack on Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:29 pm

roli wrote:After it was brought to our attention I edited pikeys out of the the original post.  Suspect the French reference was taken out by CC or the original poster.
Could I ask that we now drop this topic and do bear in mind what might be normal language to us on a day to day basis can not be written on here. There are rules we have to stick to and certainly dont want problems over the site for Admin
Thanks in anticipation folks

You've taken the 'offending' word out of the original post but repeated it in yours, Roger!

Reminds me of the classic:
"Vot is your name?"
"Don't tell him, Pike."
lol4

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Post by Greyhound on Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:42 am

daisy mae wrote:The travellers as they are called, live in a tip leave their rubbish and cost councils thousands, a different kettle of fish.


Before anyone jumps on the bandwagon, I am NOT BEING RACIST or disrespectful, just saying like it is.

You tar a complete section of society with the same brush i.e. all travelers as living in a tip etc, but then think it's ok to finish with not being dis-respectful, like that makes whatever you said ok.

What you have described is what people use the term *edited* for, which is why travelers get offended by the expression.  You've pretty much just confirmed what the OP is describing.

Using the term "just saying it like it is" doesn't give freedom to then actually use bigotry.

No offence intended, just saying it like it is  smile!
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