New construction method?

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Post by Paulmold on Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:51 am

A question was raised last night on the Facebook group. On Derby Motorhomes website it states that AS coachbuilts now have GRP inner walls as well as outer walls. This is the question concerned. There is no mention in the AS brochure 2018

Hi folks, I've just been reading about the 2018 Peugeot Coachbuilt Auto-sleepers models of which it says they now feature grp outer wall panels and now grp inner wall panels too. It didn't say they have done away with the inner wooden frame and replaced it with a plastic type frame like Swift have done.  My question is, if it was to suffer water ingress, how do they damp test a grp panel and presumably if this isnt able to be tested conventionaly then presumably the frame could be rotting inside the 'sandwich' but undetectable?


I asked Derby this morning and was told that as far as they (Richard service agent on live chat duty) was aware the only wood used is around windows to secure the frames. When asked what method was used to secure sides to roof etc he said I would have to ask the factory. Perhaps Peter Brown may know if AS are now using a method similar to Swift or Elddis.

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Post by MysteryMachine on Sat Oct 14, 2017 3:30 pm

Haha Hi Paul, yes it was me who posted it... be very interested to hear what's Autosleepers have to say...
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Post by Eltel on Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:49 pm

I’m hoping to visit the Caravan & Motorhome Show at the NEC on Tuesday (bad back permitting) I’ll see what I can find out.

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Post by Peter Brown on Sun Oct 15, 2017 3:55 pm

The 2018 models are just 2017 with a facelift. New fabrics and furniture colours will be displayed at NEC. Coachbuilts have a re-styled GRP rear panel, it looks different, has completely different light clusters and a built on fitting for cycle rack.

There s no change in the method of construction.

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Post by Paulmold on Sun Oct 15, 2017 3:57 pm

Thanks Peter, sounds like Derby Motorhomes don't know their products.

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Post by Paulmold on Sun Oct 15, 2017 3:57 pm

Please do Eltel.

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Post by Peter Brown on Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:11 pm

I cant find the reference on Derby MH site, help please?

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Post by Paulmold on Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:18 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Scroll down to 2018 coachbuilts.

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Post by Peter Brown on Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:29 pm

Thanks Paul. Maybe something in the bathroom. I'll check it out on Tuesday - wind permitting!

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Post by MysteryMachine on Sun Oct 15, 2017 4:54 pm

Rather strange they should print that and it not be true...
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Post by Liam on Sun Oct 15, 2017 8:27 pm

Peter Brown wrote:Thanks Paul.  Maybe something in the bathroom.  I'll check it out on Tuesday - wind permitting!
Peter,
The overall length (Malvern at least) appears to have been extended by 40mm (7330mm compared to previously 7290mm) - so maybe they have increased the bathroom size slightly. I would also be interested to learn the thinking behind the addition of built in cycle rack mounting points - maybe they have concern for customers who self fit and get it wrong. 
Which reminds me - I was in a cycle shop recently where they were trying to repair a badly damaged £3500 ebike that had pulled its rack off the motor-home mounts and had been dragged along the motorway for a good distance before the owner had realized the problem!!
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Post by Maasai Warrior on Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:58 pm

Sorry to hijack the thread, but the prices of ebikes have gone mad. You can get a new Royal Enfield Bullet 500 motorcycle for just over £3500 (£3999 to be exact) other models are available, or a new Honda scooter SHi 125. 

What is the world coming to!

I too will be checking with AS at the NEC on Tuesday. I think Derby Motorhomes will be there also! 

I will also be asking why some of the microwaves and supporting shelves are falling off the walls in the AS Kinghams as we maybe interested in changing to a van conversion at some point!

Pete


Last edited by Maasai Warrior on Sun Oct 15, 2017 11:05 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Extra bit)
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Post by Bad Penny on Sun Oct 15, 2017 11:07 pm

Trigano group now build MH's with a composite material (I forget it's name) computer cut with all relevant openings. In the case of Benimar the basic constuction is 95% wood free. These one piece sides are then placed into position, screwed together, sealed and made water tight. This material is apparently unaffected by moisture, unlike wood.

There is a video on facebook of the consrtuction method, taken at the Benimar factory in Spain. Which also shows the panels being cut for whichever model is on the production line.

Maybe in future AS will be built with this modern method too.

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Post by Bad Penny on Sun Oct 15, 2017 11:13 pm

Sorry should have said You Tube, not facebook.
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Post by Peter Brown on Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:52 am

Liam wrote:I would also be interested to learn the thinking behind the addition of built in cycle rack mounting points - maybe they have concern for customers who self fit and get it wrong. 
Its not just those who do it themselves that can get it wrong. Putting the mounting brackets on during manufacture ensures that the built in reinforced mounting points are used.

WRT construction, on AS the gap between inner and outer surfaces of external panels is filled with insulation material. I cant find the Benimar video on FB - does it show a similar installation of insulation?

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Post by Paulmold on Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:47 am

Bad Penny wrote:Trigano group now build MH's with a composite material (I forget it's name) computer cut with all relevant openings. In the case of Benimar the basic constuction is  95% wood free. These one piece sides are then placed into position, screwed together, sealed and made water tight. This material is apparently unaffected by moisture, unlike wood.

99% wood free according to advert in latest Practical Motorhome.

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Post by Liam on Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:50 pm

Peter Brown wrote:
Liam wrote:I would also be interested to learn the thinking behind the addition of built in cycle rack mounting points - maybe they have concern for customers who self fit and get it wrong. 
Its not just those who do it themselves that can get it wrong.  Putting the mounting brackets on during manufacture ensures that the built in reinforced mounting points are used.
I totally agree Peter, and it makes life a lot simpler and safer for after market rack fitting should the customer want it.
However, I am assuming that some sort of provision (hard points) was made within the end wall on previous years models to cater for fixing racks which A/S or their agents would use, post build, for mounting bike carriers? 
Hopefully Dan at Motor+ has put mine in the correct location!!
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Post by Peter Brown on Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:59 pm

Liam wrote: I am assuming that some sort of provision (hard points) was made within the end wall on previous years models to cater for fixing racks which A/S or their agents would use, post build, for mounting bike carriers? 

That's correct and the main AS dealers know exactly where they are - I'm sure yours is fitted to them.

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Post by Liam on Mon Oct 16, 2017 1:57 pm

Thanks for that reassurance Peter, I am sure you are right. 
I would still be interested to understand the reason for the additional length on the latest models (I am assuming that the base vehicles have not changed). 
After all 40mm will not give you much additional room inside the vehicle so it can only be something to do with rear panel strength or some new rear crash protection system.
Have a good day at the show - its blowing a hooley down here in the west at the moment.
Liam

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Post by Peter Brown on Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:09 pm

I guess the mounts for the bike rack are about 40mm deep.

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Post by Bad Penny on Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:52 pm

Peter, underneath my first post re Benimar construction, I did say You Tube not Facebook. The material is an insulating one and can be screwed and when cut is then faced each side. Chausson is the same. As Paul said the 2018 models are 99% free of wood.

The video shown is in two parts, how old I don't know and in staccato Spanish. For all I know she could be shouting at the dog.

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Post by Peter Brown on Mon Oct 16, 2017 6:10 pm

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If its the video above, they install the wooden strength members in the panel starting at about 3 mins in. The laying out, adhesion of inner and outer coverings, cutting of apertures, etc is done in exactly the same manner as AS. However the video was published in 2011 so I guess they may have moved on.

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Post by Peter Brown on Tue Oct 17, 2017 11:16 am

Some models just grp splashback but most coachbuilts now have grp inner to ceiling and walls

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Post by Eltel on Tue Oct 17, 2017 11:17 pm

On visiting the Autosleepers stand at the NEC today the only differences were as follows.

It was explained to me that the  inner roof moulding is now a one piece moulding, not two joined as previously 

The upholstery is slightly different.

The outer rear panel Is different.

Not sure if this across the range or just the Nuevo I looked at.

I’m sure there will me observations as the shows goes on.

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Post by Peter Brown on Wed Oct 18, 2017 6:57 am

Its more obvious on the bigger vans, but you will notice the absence of the tape that covered the joins in the wall covering and that the grp has a much smoother feel than the previous covering.

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